Steak Dinners

[dinny_g]

I'm very simple when it comes to steak. Part dry, bit of salt, bit of pepper, Fry it hot and fast, let it rest for a few minutes, then fucking devour it.

Nothing wrong with that approach Beany...

Been reading up on this Salt Brining method. Hmmmmm interesting

[Nefarious]

@Nef - why should I try to draw moisture out of the meat before cooking?? Serious question. I know you know what you’re talking about...

Getting technical about it, the thing that makes meat taste meaty is the maillard reaction - it's a sequential process of sugars and amnio acids reacting at the point of heat contact.
Drying the surface of the meat helps encourage the caremalisation of sugars, aiding key steps in this process. Or to put it another way, if the meat surface is wet, you're effectively boiling the sugars, which stops the caramelisation and prevents the maillard reaction from happening. Ever noticed how a cheap supermarket chicken breast never forms a golden brown crust - it just goes white/grey, then burns? That's the excess water. You can denature the protiens (strictly speaking "cooking"), but you're not developing any new flavours.

On the tenderising thing, I think the theory is that by salting the surface, you create an osmotic gradient throughout the piece of meat - water moves across semi-permiable membranes to try and equalise the salinity (I.e. water moves from low concentrations to high concentrations). The water movement helps ensure a more even distribution of water throughout the piece of meat, aids the breakdown of the tougher cell wall structures during the cooking process, and brings protein-rich liquids closer to the surface (again helping the maillard reaction). The absorbsion of some salt into the meat also helps with individual cells ability to retain moisture during cooking, which helps give a softer texture in the final product.

[Nefarious]

If you're short of something for the Christmas list, I can very much recommend this book:


Changed my way of doing a few things in the kitchen, just through properly understanding what you're actually trying to achieve.

[dinny_g]

Cheers Nef

I’ve been reading loads of stuff on this. Wisdom seems to be Salt just before for at least 45 mins or more - ideally a day - but NOT in between

I read an article from Thomas Keller I want to try. Salt and herb for 3 or 4 days, the brine gets herb infused and absorbs some of this back into the meat.

Ya never stop learning, do you...

[Nefarious]

The advice of Nosrat (from the book above), and largely borne out in my experience, is that some is better than none, and more is better than some.
I know there are definitely differences between brining (I.e. in salt water) and dry brining (without water, as I'm suggesting). Maybe the fact that I mop up all the extracted salty water (sometimes several times during the process) makes a difference.

[dinny_g]

Should have been clearer - the Keller thing is dry salting but its the moisture that’s extracted that mixes with the herds etc...

[unzippy]

@Nef - why should I try to draw moisture out of the meat before cooking?? Serious question. I know you know what you’re talking about...

Getting technical about it, the thing that makes meat taste meaty is the maillard reaction - it's a sequential process of sugars and amnio acids reacting at the point of heat contact.
Drying the surface of the meat helps encourage the caremalisation of sugars, aiding key steps in this process. Or to put it another way, if the meat surface is wet, you're effectively boiling the sugars, which stops the caramelisation and prevents the maillard reaction from happening. Ever noticed how a cheap supermarket chicken breast never forms a golden brown crust - it just goes white/grey, then burns? That's the excess water. You can denature the protiens (strictly speaking "cooking"), but you're not developing any new flavours.

On the tenderising thing, I think the theory is that by salting the surface, you create an osmotic gradient throughout the piece of meat - water moves across semi-permiable membranes to try and equalise the salinity (I.e. water moves from low concentrations to high concentrations). The water movement helps ensure a more even distribution of water throughout the piece of meat, aids the breakdown of the tougher cell wall structures during the cooking process, and brings protein-rich liquids closer to the surface (again helping the maillard reaction). The absorbsion of some salt into the meat also helps with individual cells ability to retain moisture during cooking, which helps give a softer texture in the final product.

Also known as "dry brining".
You can get very average meat to taste and feel a lot better than it should with this technique.

Or you can buy the better stuff






10 X 400g+ wagyu steaks work out at £10.50 bargain!

[ZedLeg]

If you're short of something for the Christmas list, I can very much recommend this book:


Changed my way of doing a few things in the kitchen, just through properly understanding what you're actually trying to achieve.

The Netflix series based on the book is also very good. Would recommend Cooked as well.

[Nefarious]

The Netflix series based on the book is also very good. Would recommend Cooked as well.

Cooked is amazing. Properly changed my way of doing quite a few things, and what got me started down the path around fermentation.

[GG.]

Bumping this thread...

I have an Anova sous vide cooker given to me as a birthday present that has sat in a cupboard for 3 years

Finally got around to digging it out yesterday to cook some 4 week dry aged sirloin. Well - it was a bit of a revelation! I think I'm likely a convert to this way of cooking.

Perfect every time and will sit there at optimum temperature for potentially hours until everything else is ready, at which point you pull it out, pat it dry and sear it in the pan. Think I'll try with a marinade in the bags next time rather than just salt/pepper/rosemary.

[dinny_g]

Looks lush GG...

[Zonda_]

Now that does look good.

[Alex_]

Just googled sous vide cooker. Seems like a lot of effort for something you could do with a pan in a few minutes anyway.

[GG.]

Trust me, the results are much much better than you'd get by cooking it the whole way through in the pan. Its perfectly cooked edge to edge and the setup time is literally seconds then it can sit there cooking in the background whilst you do other stuff.

[dinny_g]

How long would take to get, say an inch thick sirloin or Rib eye to cooked - say 50 to 55 degrees - GG ?

[DaveE]

Trust me, the results are much much better than you'd get by cooking it the whole way through in the pan. Its perfectly cooked edge to edge and the setup time is literally seconds then it can sit there cooking in the background whilst you do other stuff.

We were given one of these just recently and I would agree that it gives a much more juicy result than pan-frying alone.

A good tip for when you sear them in the pan afterwards is to fill a saucepan with water and use that to press the steaks down into the frying pan - you get a much better sear, more quickly (so it doesn't get chance to cook "into" the steak).

We did a big piece of pork the other week - it looked awful coming out of the sous vide, but after it had been seared it looked (and was) delicious. Nice and pink inside, but thoroughly cooked and really juicy (I always find that pork normally dries out in the oven).

Poached pears are lovely from a sous vide too...

[GG.]

How long would take to get, say an inch thick sirloin or Rib eye to cooked - say 50 to 55 degrees - GG ?

Minimum time to be fully cooked is 45 mins I believe. 1- 2 hours is ideal and apparently the texture changes somewhat after that point (though you could in theory leave it in there for 24 hours and it won't be any more 'done').

[GG.]

Trust me, the results are much much better than you'd get by cooking it the whole way through in the pan. Its perfectly cooked edge to edge and the setup time is literally seconds then it can sit there cooking in the background whilst you do other stuff.

We were given one of these just recently and I would agree that it gives a much more juicy result than pan-frying alone.

A good tip for when you sear them in the pan afterwards is to fill a saucepan with water and use that to press the steaks down into the frying pan - you get a much better sear, more quickly (so it doesn't get chance to cook "into" the steak).

We did a big piece of pork the other week - it looked awful coming out of the sous vide, but after it had been seared it looked (and was) delicious. Nice and pink inside, but thoroughly cooked and really juicy (I always find that pork normally dries out in the oven).

Poached pears are lovely from a sous vide too...

Sounds good - I'm keen to try some lamb in it too or something fibrous cooked for a longer period such as beef brisket.

[dinny_g]

How long would take to get, say an inch thick sirloin or Rib eye to cooked - say 50 to 55 degrees - GG ?

Minimum time to be fully cooked is 45 mins I believe. 1- 2 hours is ideal and apparently the texture changes somewhat after that point (though you could in theory leave it in there for 24 hours and it won't be any more 'done').

Cheers GG...

[Jobbo]

I used the reverse sear method last week. My wife won’t eat steak if it’s pink, so generally I just overcook hers, but reverse searing allowed me to get it cooked through without overcooking it, without the faff of sous vide. I’m a convert.