Bye bye Starmer

[Alex88]

Good timing that this all came out just after PMQ's!

[IanF]

Non-exec until 2017 of a Russian conglomerate which includes a major defence technology manufacturer with an ex-Ruskie PM as Chair (annexation of Crimea 2014) also highlights a questionable decision.. maybe no one at that level is “really” clean? What a sorry state of affairs.. OV9 political party can’t come soon enough!

https://news.sky.com/story/politics-lat ... eblog-body

[duncs500]

Not looking good for Starmer. At all.

He said he wasn't aware of the extent of Mandelson's relationship with Epstein, but it's increasingly looking like that wasn't true..

I dunno, so far the release doesn't really tell me much of anything. Starmer’s Director of Communications at the time said to Starmer something like he was satisfied with Peter Mandelson’s responses when questioned about his contact with Epstein.

If you're the PM (or indeed anyone in a senior leadership role) you've got enough on your plate that you have to take information from your advisors and make a call. I can well see how the decision making process might have happened in terms of the benefits of Madleson's links to big dogs in the US if he'd been told broadly that the Epstein links weren't significant. Starmer was foolish to take the risk given the potential dirt on him, but we already knew that.

I still don't see any evidence that Starmer acted in a dishonest way, or without integrity.

Maybe that will come out, but as far as I can tell so far, this is nothing new.

[Rich B]

There’s a fair amount being hung on someone being “friends with someone who broke the law*” that gets ignored in plenty of other situations.

(*yes, it was some pretty disgusting breaks.)

Everyone is being pretty coy about it - yes, there was a risk hiring Mandy, but we needed someone in the same billionaire pedo circles as the people he was dealing with, so we dragged him out of multiple sackings to do the dirty work.

The Russian Non-executive stuff and the sharing financial details with Epstein is obviously an issue.

[ZedLeg]

That “well he’s from the same cesspit as the people he’s going to be working with” argument always felt like justification after the fact tbh.

Also shines a big light on the truth that everyone knew he was a danger and gave him a high paying civil service job anyway.

[Rich B]

That “well he’s from the same cesspit as the people he’s going to be working with” argument always felt like justification after the fact tbh.

It was pretty front and centre throughout - He’d already been sacked twice before, everyone knew it was a serious risk, but all the opposition crying now are pretending they somehow didn’t realise at the time.

Grubby guy knows grubbier guy.

[ZedLeg]

My problem with that reasoning is all they gained was another Mandelson related embarrassment.

Personally I would rather no one in my government was close personal friends with a monstrous paedophile who ran social engineering experiments for his own gain.

[duncs500]

That “well he’s from the same cesspit as the people he’s going to be working with” argument always felt like justification after the fact tbh.

It was pretty front and centre throughout - He’d already been sacked twice before, everyone knew it was a serious risk, but all the opposition crying now are pretending they somehow didn’t realise at the time.

Grubby guy knows grubbier guy.

I'd have to look back at when he was appointed, but my recollection of the media reaction at the time was just that.

As much as I'm sure many in this country would happily completely set fire to our relationship with the US at this point, it isn't really a sensible option either politically or economically. We all hope that they will clean up their act post Trump, but we'd be better to be there when that happens rather than set fire to bridges that continue to burn after Trump is gone.

[jamcg]

He was Hartlepool MP for years, and most people I talk to in the area say the same thing- “who the fuck gave that man a job???”

[Rich B]

My problem with that reasoning is all they gained was another Mandelson related embarrassment.

Personally I would rather no one in my government was close personal friends with a monstrous paedophile who ran social engineering experiments for his own gain.

Jeez, you’re after the moon on a stick!

[ZedLeg]

[Marv]

I wonder if he is charged under the national security act, he'll have to give the £75k severance pay back?

Absolutely disgusting that they gave him severance pay. Apparently severance pay wasn't even in his contract, they just seemed scared of him.

[Rich B]

I wonder if he is charged under the national security act, he'll have to give the £75k severance pay back?

Absolutely disgusting that they gave him severance pay. Apparently severance pay wasn't even in his contract, they just seemed scared of him.

Yep, it’s fairly comical that the government who are responsible for coming up with the laws around employment, are so afraid of using them correctly (for fear of it costing hundreds of thousands of pounds) and would rather settle for tens of thousands of pounds instead and avoid the process.

[Nefarious]

There is a huge gulf between what is being said in public and what must be being said behind closed doors.

I largely agree with Rich that the conversation around the time of his appointment was probably something along the lines of "you'll have to hold your noses chaps, but Mandy is probably our best chance of having *any* influence at all in Washington", not least because he knew where the Epstein bodies are buried. Perhaps also with the reasoning that if the Epstein thing properly blew up, there would be bigger names (primarily Trump) in the firing line, and hence on the principle of mutually assured destruction, the Americans would be forced to protect Mandy.

But nobody can say that *now*. Everyone from MPs to the BBC is terrified of saying the slightest word against Trump for fear of lawsuits or spiteful reprisals. "We knew our guy was dodgy, but we assumed Trump's efforts to hide his own corruption and noncery would make it alright" would probably come with consequences.