Coronavirus

[Simon]

Can we keep Scotland but bin off the poisonous dwarf?

[GG.]

We’re a bunch of communist whingers bleeding good old England dry though

45% of you are

[GG.]

Can we keep Scotland but bin off the poisonous dwarf?

We can make East Smithfield available...

[Beany]

I cut out the middleman and just came down here and started stealing your jobs and your women.

[dinny_g]

Can we keep Scotland but bin off the poisonous dwarf?

That’s down to the Scots

[DeskJockey]

I cut out the middleman and just came down here and started stealing your jobs and your women.

How's that going for you?

[Beany]

I cut out the middleman and just came down here and started stealing your jobs and your women.

How's that going for you?

Fucking terribly, honestly.

[duncs500]

Very poor show.

[dinny_g]

Jesus Christ that’s beyond shameful...

[Foz]

Can we keep Scotland but bin off the poisonous dwarf?

The Salmon will sink her...

[Simon]

Is is amateur hour over in Brussels right now?

Fact is that we put our order in to AZ 3 months before the EU, because they choose to be typically bureaucratic and slow. That meant that AZ were able to use our early payments to upgrade their UK manufacturing plants and iron out and kinks in production. The EU, apparently, signed exactly the same contract as they would've signed 3 months earlier, but because they are a dinosaur and insisted on thinking that they'd get a better deal (than £3/shot?!?) by clubbing together and acting as one they got their order in late, meaning that AZ didn't have time to do the same works to the EU based plants. This issue was directly caused by the EU.

Now Ursula on der Leyen wants to tap the UK plants for vaccines at the detriment to UK residents because they couldn't sort their shit out, and to compound ignorance, belligerence and stupidity with outright childishness and spitefulness they then go and enact Article 16 of the NI protocol to stop NI getting vaccines and to stop them being a back door for vaccines into the UK also.

So during Brexit negotiations they're all like 'Ireland is sacred, GFA must be respected, blah blah blah' but suddenly their slothness and incompetence risks being highlighted in the vaccine rollout (for a vaccine they've only approved TODAY) and they throw 'no-Ireland-borders' under the bus quicker than Trump disposing of Giuliani's 'services'.

What a shit show.

The irony is that if they do enact a vaccine export blockade to us then they would expect the very same in return, and what with one more vaccine being made in the Teeside and another on the horizon it might have been in UK Govt's gift in a couple of months to say to AZ that we could export to the EU the surplus vaccines we'd then have whilst we still make our timetable with what's produced here between 3 different manufacturers. That wouldn't then happen would it?

Tossers.

[integrale_evo]

A quick question because I am the stupids.

Why do we have well over 200million doses on order which for a population of 68million means three doses for everyone in the country, which in reality will be lots more because a fair chunk will refuse to have it.

Do these massive orders allow the manufacturers to ramp up production quicker? Are we stockpiling in case the effects drop off ( do they have any idea how long they can be stored ) so they can use any excess as a bargaining tool elsewhere?

[GG.]

Is is amateur hour over in Brussels right now?

Fact is that we put our order in to AZ 3 months before the EU, because they choose to be typically bureaucratic and slow. That meant that AZ were able to use our early payments to upgrade their UK manufacturing plants and iron out and kinks in production. The EU, apparently, signed exactly the same contract as they would've signed 3 months earlier, but because they are a dinosaur and insisted on thinking that they'd get a better deal (than £3/shot?!?) by clubbing together and acting as one they got their order in late, meaning that AZ didn't have time to do the same works to the EU based plants. This issue was directly caused by the EU.

Now Ursula on der Leyen wants to tap the UK plants for vaccines at the detriment to UK residents because they couldn't sort their shit out, and to compound ignorance, belligerence and stupidity with outright childishness and spitefulness they then go and enact Article 16 of the NI protocol to stop NI getting vaccines and to stop them being a back door for vaccines into the UK also.

So during Brexit negotiations they're all like 'Ireland is sacred, GFA must be respected, blah blah blah' but suddenly their slothness and incompetence risks being highlighted in the vaccine rollout (for a vaccine they've only approved TODAY) and they throw 'no-Ireland-borders' under the bus quicker than Trump disposing of Giuliani's 'services'.

What a shit show.

The irony is that if they do enact a vaccine export blockade to us then they would expect the very same in return, and what with one more vaccine being made in the Teeside and another on the horizon it might have been in UK Govt's gift in a couple of months to say to AZ that we could export to the EU the surplus vaccines we'd then have whilst we still make our timetable with what's produced here between 3 different manufacturers. That wouldn't then happen would it?

Tossers.

You haven’t even got the ‘good’ bit yet. The latest proposed wheeze is to use article 122 of the TEU to forcibly take control of the vaccination production centres of the pharma companies in case export controls are not enough.

It most likely won’t lead to anything but the fact they’re considering ‘nationalising’ (ho ho - EU not being a federal nation of course) the production plants is pretty nuts.

[GG.]

A quick question because I am the stupids.

Why do we have well over 200million doses on order which for a population of 68million means three doses for everyone in the country, which in reality will be lots more because a fair chunk will refuse to have it.

Do these massive orders allow the manufacturers to ramp up production quicker? Are we stockpiling in case the effects drop off ( do they have any idea how long they can be stored ) so they can use any excess as a bargaining tool elsewhere?

Not sure how the figures play out when you take into account that all bar the Jannsen vaccine announced today need two doses, but I don’t think there is any master plan other than hedge your bets and build in redundancy to ensure we have enough if certain vaccines are not available, don’t work as well as the trials state, etc.

The money we’re talking about is trivial in the grand scheme of things - I think we’re paying 3 quid a dose for AZ’s which is £600m for the 200m figure you quoted.

[John]

A quick question because I am the stupids.

Why do we have well over 200million doses on order which for a population of 68million means three doses for everyone in the country, which in reality will be lots more because a fair chunk will refuse to have it.

Do these massive orders allow the manufacturers to ramp up production quicker? Are we stockpiling in case the effects drop off ( do they have any idea how long they can be stored ) so they can use any excess as a bargaining tool elsewhere?

It could be like the flu jab where a shot is needed every year.

[GG.]

It most likely will so we may be able to use excess for a down payment on vaccinations for 2022’s variants.

[Simon]

For any doubt about this 'best efforts of EU plants' bit in the contract too, I'm gonna copy-paste this helpful analysis from the comments section of this Register article that explains how the EU haven't correctly redacted the contract they've published, allowing all the redacted sections to appear for the world to see. The useful comment is:

"Clearly states the first batch is manufactured in EU, not UK
The contract clearly states that AstraZenica has to try to manufacture the 300m doses of vaccine for the EU, in the EU.

Section 5.1 says "AstraZenica shall use it's Best Reasonable Efforts to manufacture the Initial Europe Doses within the EU for distribution, and to deliver to the Distribution Hubs....".

Let me repeat that, it has to try it's best to "manufacture the Initial Europe Doses within the EU". And "the EU" specifically does not include the UK (see Section 5.4, which says "the EU [...] for the purpose of this Section 5.4 only shall include the United Kingdom" - which makes it clear that in *other* sections the EU does NOT include the United Kingdom). The "Initial Europe Doses" means the first 300 million doses, which are what they're currently trying to get. Note this doesn't apply to the 100 million doses that the EU can choose to buy after that - but it can't take delivery of the 100 million extra doses until after the first 300 million doses have been delivered.

Now, it does also have to "use it's Best Reasonable Efforts to manufacture the Vaccine at manufacturing sites located within the EU (which, for the purpose of this Section 5.4 only shall include the United Kingdom)". However, nothing says it has to give doses manufactured in the UK to the EU. And 5.1 is fairly explicit about how the initial batch of 300 million doses should be manufactured in the EU. Presumably this section is talking about the following 100 million+ doses."

I think that's a slam dunk for AZ against the EU.

[Mito Man]

The vaccines were ordered long before testing was concluded. We are very fortunate that so far all of them have been approved but as is clear now it’s also better to have a choice because we don’t know which vaccine will work with what future virus mutations.

[Marv]

It most likely will so we may be able to use excess for a down payment on vaccinations for 2022’s variants.

Can we give future mutations/variants that come from the UK a name? I'm thinking Boris would be a suitable name for the next one.

[GG.]

It most likely will so we may be able to use excess for a down payment on vaccinations for 2022’s variants.

Can we give future mutations/variants that come from the UK a name? I'm thinking Boris would be a suitable name for the next one.

If it makes you feel better, go for it.