OV9

Risking your life in a tiny boat fleeing from France does not make sense. Work in france, get some money to legally migrate and there is not an issue.

True, I read that we've made it really easy for people to move here from other countries legally recently.

ZedLeg wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:51 am True, I read that we've made it really easy for people to move here from other countries legally recently.

Well, apart from European Union countries. We've made that more difficult.

dinny_g wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:35 am

Jobbo wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:14 am

dinny_g wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:07 am

What's so bad in France that their desperation forces them to continue their journey away from War by undertaking a life threatening trip across the channel to get to the UK ??

How many asylum seekers stay in France? Plenty. Everyone in this country (except a few purebred Jocks) is the product of immigration and there's no reason why people shouldn't be entitled to seek asylum here after coming through France first. Maybe they speak better English than French so consider the opportunity for a better life to be greater here?

Well exactly - I mean look at me - I came here because the opportunities were better.

so we can agree then that those Asylum Seekers are safe in France - they've escaped the war and the tyranny that as threatening their lives and the lives of their family's - yes ?

So coming here is no longer anything to do with escaping war and simply down to a choice of somewhere they'd prefer to live ?

Escaping war is the reason for leaving their home country. Seeking asylum in the country of their choice is about far more than just crossing the border.

I find it somewhat amazing that someone who has emigrated themselves would not understand this

I absolutely get that Jobbo - it's just not always the narrative that is portrayed in certain corners of the media.

dinny_g wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 10:46 am I absolutely get that Jobbo - it's just not always the narrative that is portrayed in certain corners of the media.

The only media narrative I see is the Daily Mail/GB News one that all asylum seekers are bad. So yes, I agree that it's not as portrayed in the media. it's far more complex and a human rights issue.

Is that the same corner where grifters are chasing boats around the channel banging on about "economic migrants"?

It's all bullshit by the way, conservatives love foreign workers. It's the easiest way of keeping wages and workers rights down to a bare minimum.

Yes, the Mail / Express do paint a very one dimensional (and wholly incorrect) view of the situation and that is not limited to the "Opinion" sections.

Just to be clear by the way, I'm not for closing borders or turning our backs on those less fortunate than ourselves, by sole virtue of where they happen to be born. We should and do help our fair share of those seeking asylum and we need to continue to do this. (although of course, fare share is subjective)

I would prefer some more honesty in the way the crisis is being reported though. One of the main drivers behind the people smugglers of the channel is re-united families but there doesn't appear to be a major problem with people trying to get back into France to be reunited with loved ones.

It's hard to see past a conclusion that life in the UK for asylum seekers, while far from acceptable is still very much more preferable in many ways to life as an asylum seeker in France.

Is being a desirable place for people to come and live a bad thing?

Desirable for what reasons? Leap frogging desperate families who are legally here for housing when there's a shortage is wrong. How in the lovey dovey happy clappy world does that get solved? Who pays for it?

The government could easily pay for social housing if it wanted to. Would rather pay for tax breaks for their pals though.

ZedLeg wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 11:53 am The government could easily pay for social housing if it wanted to. Would rather pay for tax breaks for their pals though.

The answer is the tax payers for it not the government.

Yeah, I feel like we're going to have a fundamental disagreement about how taxes should be spent

Ive already said any legal migrants are great and add value - the downside is with you thinking this is ok currently the brave souls who do make it here get refused entry after months. They then vanish and have to live under the radar for cash jobs getting abused by even more criminals / slavers. No so happy clappy is it.

I never said the current system is good. I would rather see people get here safely and be able to find somewhere to live and work.

Unfortunately, it's government policy to divide and conquer. Turn the poor here against immigrants while they funnel all the money they could be spending on helping into the pockets of people who don't need it.

dinny_g wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 11:15 am One of the main drivers behind the people smugglers of the channel is re-united families but there doesn't appear to be a major problem with people trying to get back into France to be reunited with loved ones.

Where would such asylum seekers trying to get to France via the UK originate from? Ireland? Shetland? Not surprising there's no real traffic the other way...

Asylum seeker from, say Syria, makes the Journey and ends up in the UK via Spain or Italy and France. A period of time later other family members also make the trip from Syria to join them and find themselves in Northern France.

An article I read from the UNHCR (Can't find it now but it makes sense) is that a significant portion of the "business" the people smugglers are doing is bringing people across the channel to unite families in the UK, a Father, Mother and children group will get a lot more than the father on his own.

There is an argument to way "Make the route to the UK from France Safer" but shouldn't we be also asking the French to make asylum for a family better so they don't fee the have to make the trip. Dad goes back to France, rather than having to risk his kids lived to get them here

If only we were part of a government union that would make it easy to discuss these types of issues with neighbouring countries

ZedLeg wrote: ↑Fri Jul 23, 2021 12:57 pm If only we were part of a government union that would make it easy to discuss these types of issues with neighbouring countries

I think you've ruined your own argument there laddo.

How so?