OV9

Marv wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:41 am

Pete_ wrote: ↑Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:00 pm Excellent race! Great to see Riccardo winning, and Norris being happy about the result as well.
I think the Verstappen penalty is fair, but one thing I haven't seen anyone talking about (not that I've been looking very hard) is that I thought it was a bit out of order for Hamilton to be trying to get his car moving again whilst Verstappen was climbing out of his. If Hamilton managed to get traction then that could have been quite nasty. I appreciate Hamilton maybe wouldn't have been able to see, but I guess the team would have radio's him. I'd be interested to know the order of events between the team telling Hamilton to switch off his engine, Hamilton stopping trying to move his car, and Verstappen getting out of his car because that wasn't clear on the C4 coverage.

I haven't seen it myself, but apparently Verstappen tried to move his car when it was over Hamilton's car... spinning tyre was close to Hamilton's head.

Quite a few people noted that Verstappen walked away without checking that Hamilton was okay...

Yep I noticed both those things as well. Verstappen is on the throttle at 0:59 in this vid and,although his wheels are clear of Hamilton's halo at that point he wouldn't necessarily have known that.



I guess that happened within a second or two of the impact so going on the throttle seems like quite an instinctual response, whereas Hamilton trying to move his car seemed more of an intentional decision.

Pete_ wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:00 am

Marv wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:41 am

Pete_ wrote: ↑Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:00 pm Excellent race! Great to see Riccardo winning, and Norris being happy about the result as well.
I think the Verstappen penalty is fair, but one thing I haven't seen anyone talking about (not that I've been looking very hard) is that I thought it was a bit out of order for Hamilton to be trying to get his car moving again whilst Verstappen was climbing out of his. If Hamilton managed to get traction then that could have been quite nasty. I appreciate Hamilton maybe wouldn't have been able to see, but I guess the team would have radio's him. I'd be interested to know the order of events between the team telling Hamilton to switch off his engine, Hamilton stopping trying to move his car, and Verstappen getting out of his car because that wasn't clear on the C4 coverage.

I haven't seen it myself, but apparently Verstappen tried to move his car when it was over Hamilton's car... spinning tyre was close to Hamilton's head.

Quite a few people noted that Verstappen walked away without checking that Hamilton was okay...

Yep I noticed both those things as well. Verstappen is on the throttle at 0:59 in this vid and,although his wheels are clear of Hamilton's halo at that point he wouldn't necessarily have known that.



I guess that happened within a second or two of the impact so going on the throttle seems like quite an instinctual response, whereas Hamilton trying to move his car seemed more of an intentional decision.

To be clear though, for the incident as a whole and the response after I think Verstappen was much more in the wrong.

Neither driver acted partucularly wisely imho - Ham trying to reverse out when he was unable to see what the Stapp was doing - could have been stepping out of the cockpit at that exact moment - a bit reckless. Similarly Max petulantly striding away from another driver without checking his condition - he didn’t know his wheel had been on top of Hamo’s noggin, but he did know his car had been on top of Ham’s - bit disappointing on a human level.

All of the above is easy to say afterwards, having considered various angles and slo-mo footage. Heat of the moment is likely to be different. I’ve never had a car on my head. Quite possible Ham had no idea whether the car might shift and move back over him, or catch fire whilst trapping him - so survival instinct probably kicked in.

Max is harder for me to rationalise - mostly due to his the team radio comment.

F1 is always heat of the moment nonsense followed by more reasoned debate.

Remember Lewis punted Max off a few races ago and celebrated when Max was still in hospital getting checks. Lewis did not know but it clearly bothered Max a lot.

What is he now? 23 or so? We were probably unreasoning nobbers at that age, your brain is not fully developed yet we expect them to be perfect and reasonable when they are competing for the pinnacle of motorsport's crown.

I thought it was probably 60/40 Max to blame purely because other people had managed to get round side by side or lifted slightly. Now and again he (Max) still shows how young he is.

He acted like a child and if a F1 driver can’t realise that his car is on top of someone else’s they need to have a chat with themselves.

Dave!

I don’t feel this “you are ahead and therefore entitled to take the racing line” rule existed in the past? It seems to give drivers carte Blanche to push another driver off the road despite knowing they are there?

The Silverstone incident was predominantly LH being aggressive, but again - the levels of aggression were totally normal for MV and he'd done the same/similar to others many times. And he wasn't being stitched back together or put on life support - the whole GP doesn't stop because someone's having a check up in hospital.

Ironically, the incident on Sunday probably would have been avoided if LH had been more aggressive and not turned in for the apex on the first part of the corner, leaving a tempting gap.

Gavin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:59 am F1 is always heat of the moment nonsense followed by more reasoned debate.

Remember Lewis punted Max off a few races ago and celebrated when Max was still in hospital getting checks. Lewis did not know but it clearly bothered Max a lot.

What is he now? 23 or so? We were probably unreasoning nobbers at that age, your brain is not fully developed yet we expect them to be perfect and reasonable when they are competing for the pinnacle of motorsport's crown.

I thought it was probably 60/40 Max to blame purely because other people had managed to get round side by side or lifted slightly. Now and again he (Max) still shows how young he is.

MV is in his 7th year in F1. Naivety is no longer a reasonable excuse. He's just a throbber.

I’d wager that Max will still be driving the same way when he’s 30.

Yep, used to be youthful exuberance and everyone learnt to jump out of the way when he sent it. I’m quite glad Hamilton has decided to not let him have his own way like a spoilt brat every time.

integrale_evo wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:12 pm Yep, used to be youthful exuberance and everyone learnt to jump out of the way when he sent it. I’m quite glad Hamilton has decided to not let him have his own way like a spoilt brat every time.

This

F1 always needs a villain, now Seb is such a swell chap Max is the next man up.

It's funny, a lot of people hate LH, but I've seen views towards him soften now Max is on the scene.

I’ve never been a huge Hamilton fan, often think he’s a bit of a whiney knob, although undeniably a great driver. My thoughts on the current clashes are definitely not from the point of view of a Hamilton fanboy.

Wonder if red bull took note of all the negative press from the silverstone incident which is why they’ve softened their ‘Max can do no wrong’ stance a little bit?

I have warmed a bit to THE HAM as I hear less petulant whining. That could be due to reduced F1 viewing but whatever.

mik wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:06 pm I have warmed a bit to THE HAM as I hear less petulant whining. That could be due to reduced F1 viewing but whatever.

No, he's definitely less bolshy than he used to be. I'm assuming already smashing enough records to go down as an all time great probably takes the desperation to win at all costs out of it a bit.

Now he just wants to win because winning is fun.

I like Hamilton most days - great driver and he’s done a lot of work for diversity and he’s not afraid to speak up. He was the only driver who kept saying fans should be refunded for Spa even though almost all of them were Dutch and were just happy that Max finished ahead of him.
The Hamilton fashion guru who usually dresses up like an idiot can fuck off.

“It looks like his legs are getting married”

Yep, I have no interest in LHs life outside F1 whatsoever, I like his driving. I like aggressive drivers who are instinctive racers. Max is quick, but never considers that he might come out worse and suffers because of it. Then he makes everything worse by whining like an entitled teenager.

240PP wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:55 pm “It looks like his legs are getting married”

Are the people standing either side of Lewis men, women or transsexual? Designer fashion is a joke.

I always think in another life if I was invited to one these silly things, I'd turn up in a pair of Tesco jeans and a £2 T-shirt