OV9

I've also read some articles about people who've had COVID19 and not died. There is obviously quite a lot of them, and the effects can hang around a very long time and be pretty nasty, so it's not just about the death rate. I think if you get flu and don't die, you make a full recovery; in contrast, look at Derek Draper who has been in an induced coma for the best part of 3 months.

Jobbo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:09 pm I've also read some articles about people who've had COVID19 and not died. There is obviously quite a lot of them, and the effects can hang around a very long time and be pretty nasty, so it's not just about the death rate. I think if you get flu and don't die, you make a full recovery; in contrast, look at Derek Draper who has been in an induced coma for the best part of 3 months.

Thing is without the focus on what happens in some cases of Flu where people may suffer complications we don't know the extent or the numbers of people that this can happen to, septacemia is perfectly possible from a case of flu as it's an automimmune condition and that can leave someone with massive longterm complications, however we rarely see any media focus on this.

https://www.sepsis.org/sepsisand/influenza/

The fact that a subset of cases of Covid can cause longer term issues and also in the case of Derek being the partner of a media personality means that the media will focus on this to support the narrative that they have been pedalling for months now.

I think the point I am trying to make is that is it is extremely difficult to cut through the media crap to get to actual facts.

Remember the flu season runs for 6 months, and COVID has claimed 40k in 2 and a bit even with pretty extreme measures to slow the spread so direct comparisons are pretty pointless.

We went down to the beach this morning to take the nipper for his first time. Obviously not Bournemouth or anything, but down to Lancing on a friend's recommendation. Got to a half empty car park at 9:40 this morning, sat on a sandy bit whilst the tide was out for a couple of hours then back home at lunch after feeding NoNo in the car (timed so that he would have both his naps in the car).

There really wasn't many people down there, but it's probably helped that it was barely 20 degrees in Lancing, yet just 25 miles north back at home it's 28. Such a huge variance for such a small distance.

So we're not feeling guilty at all about that trip, and we got a chance to dip NoNo's feet in the water for the first time.

My sisters been to various beaches around Norfolk this week and all have been pretty much deserted.

God knows why everyone flocks to Bournemouth / Southend anyway, they look more crowded than any beach I’d want to spend any time on even when not in the middle of a pandemic

As for the long term damage from corona, it’s very real, my mrs still doesn’t feel great and hasn’t really improved since coming out of hospital.

At the time she felt massively better, but that’s more to do with how bad she was at the time.

She’s still off work and has got a scan booked for the end of July.

I still get the odd moment with what feels like a chest palpitation and have to have a couple of deep exhales for no apparent reason but can still go about my daily business fine.

Got a letter through for the random testing today, should get test kits in a week or so

integrale_evo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:44 pm My sisters been to various beaches around Norfolk this week and all have been pretty much deserted.

God knows why everyone flocks to Bournemouth / Southend anyway, they look more crowded than any beach I’d want to spend any time on even when not in the middle of a pandemic

Are those the Norfolk beaches where the locals have put up signs telling Londoners to fuck off?

Think Aldeburgh and Southwold here have got a bit busy. Nothing stupid like Bournemouth/Southend though. I just stay away and go to a better empty beach a few miles down the road, if I wanna gaze at the sea with a thousand-yard stare!

Bournemouth is busy because when you look across SE England it's just about the nearest proper sandy beach. West Wittering is there too but you have to pre-book your parking at the mo to limit numbers and they don't have any 'free' slots for days.

integrale_evo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:48 pm As for the long term damage from corona, it’s very real, my mrs still doesn’t feel great and hasn’t really improved since coming out of hospital.

At the time she felt massively better, but that’s more to do with how bad she was at the time.

She’s still off work and has got a scan booked for the end of July.

I still get the odd moment with what feels like a chest palpitation and have to have a couple of deep exhales for no apparent reason but can still go about my daily business fine.

I have a colleague who continues to experience breathing difficulties 3 months after his initial coronavirus infection and hospital stay. CT of his chest completely normal interestingly enough. Between Oxford and Cambridge we're running studies looking at lungs, heart and brain in the long term following covid infection: not much coming up in the heart but seeing things in the lungs for sure.

There have been a couple of very strange covid presentations that I have seen affecting the brain: one was a person who became rapidly and uncontrollably delerious and we found had a covid encephalitis, the other had a standard covid pneumonitis but as he recovered developed a Parkinsons-like movement disorder.

Did the movement disorder resolve? Wonder if some of the neurological side effects could be triggered by low blood sats/hypoxia

Explosive Newt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:31 pm

integrale_evo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:48 pm As for the long term damage from corona, it’s very real, my mrs still doesn’t feel great and hasn’t really improved since coming out of hospital.

At the time she felt massively better, but that’s more to do with how bad she was at the time.

She’s still off work and has got a scan booked for the end of July.

I still get the odd moment with what feels like a chest palpitation and have to have a couple of deep exhales for no apparent reason but can still go about my daily business fine.

I have a colleague who continues to experience breathing difficulties 3 months after his initial coronavirus infection and hospital stay. CT of his chest completely normal interestingly enough. Between Oxford and Cambridge we're running studies looking at lungs, heart and brain in the long term following covid infection: not much coming up in the heart but seeing things in the lungs for sure.

There have been a couple of very strange covid presentations that I have seen affecting the brain: one was a person who became rapidly and uncontrollably delerious and we found had a covid encephalitis, the other had a standard covid pneumonitis but as he recovered developed a Parkinsons-like movement disorder.

I hoe they all go on to make a full recovery.

GG. wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 9:23 pm Did the movement disorder resolve? Wonder if some of the neurological side effects could be triggered by low blood sats/hypoxia

The disorder lagged some way behind the resolution of the breathing issues. There was a theory that it was a triggered autoimmune thing like myoclonus-opsoclonus and some response to steroids and immunoglobulin infusions. Lost track of what was happening after leaving ICU.

Explosive Newt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:31 pm

integrale_evo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:48 pm As for the long term damage from corona, it’s very real, my mrs still doesn’t feel great and hasn’t really improved since coming out of hospital.

At the time she felt massively better, but that’s more to do with how bad she was at the time.

She’s still off work and has got a scan booked for the end of July.

I still get the odd moment with what feels like a chest palpitation and have to have a couple of deep exhales for no apparent reason but can still go about my daily business fine.

I have a colleague who continues to experience breathing difficulties 3 months after his initial coronavirus infection and hospital stay. CT of his chest completely normal interestingly enough. Between Oxford and Cambridge we're running studies looking at lungs, heart and brain in the long term following covid infection: not much coming up in the heart but seeing things in the lungs for sure.

There have been a couple of very strange covid presentations that I have seen affecting the brain: one was a person who became rapidly and uncontrollably delerious and we found had a covid encephalitis, the other had a standard covid pneumonitis but as he recovered developed a Parkinsons-like movement disorder.

On the breathing difficulty front it's been noted that in cases of Sepsis following on from Flu that PTSD is present sometimes, symtoms of PTSD are things like breating difficulties (standard Anxiety attack symptom). If these patients are presenting with normal scans could the effect be similar? After the media hype and having to endure either oxygen therapy or full ventilation it wouldn't be surprising at all if they are left with long term psycological issues.

Difficult question - breathlessness can be a very difficult symptom and even if the lung tissues look free of scarring on the scan, there are other questions:
- Are there problems with blood getting through the lung (i.e. blood clots)
- Are there problems with oxygen getting into blood and carbon dioxide getting out of it (gas transfer)
- Are there problems with the way the heart is pumping (strength of contraction and the ability to increase heart rate/force to deal with demand)
- Are there problems with the way the brain senses and responds to hypoxia
... and you have to rule all these bits out before you start pinning it on psychological issues. We still don't know much about coronavirus so whether there is a particular post-coronavirus syndrome and what exactly causes it remains a topic of research.

Most intensive cares I have worked in do a follow up and psychological support system for ICU survivors, it's a serious problem and always has been despite research on how to mitigate it. This is of course going to be stretched by the glut of patients going through the service now, it remains a challenging time, so patients getting access to talking therapies or pulmonary rehabilitation courses is going to be difficult.

Was just wondering, are you guys wearing a mask when in shops and the like?

Yes. It is a simple thing to do.

Do have to remember that people can't see you smiling, so have to be more communicative.

Ascender wrote: ↑Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:18 pm Was just wondering, are you guys wearing a mask when in shops and the like?

Yep. Work gave us a bunch so we don’t infect the general population when we’re out and about.

I’m quite taken with the ones from Charles Tyrwhitt though https://www.ctshirts.com/uk/mens-acces ... ace-masks/

Ascender wrote: ↑Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:18 pm Was just wondering, are you guys wearing a mask when in shops and the like?

Nah, but we live in the back end of nowhere.

Ascender wrote: ↑Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:18 pm Was just wondering, are you guys wearing a mask when in shops and the like?

We got in a Uber last weekend and it said to wear a mask - once inside the driver said you can take it off if you like, which I did.

I'm a little bit reverting back to my initial question about the whole thing being a load of bollocks.