OV9

Change the tune.

5 years of it to come.

I'm amazed that they look at Brexit - the difficult untangling of one country from a supranational institution - and think 'yeah, that looks really easy, I'd love me some of that action'.

Two things

1) If leaving the EU is messy, imagine how hard it would be to separate Scotland from the UK.
2) Even if they did get their wish and then re-joined the EU by themselves, they'd then be part of Europe. Which means customs checks and some sort of border between Scotland and the rest of the UK.

The poisonous dwarf should focus their efforts on dealing with Scotlands other problems, rather than trying to introduce new ones.

Thought the tories have denied any possibility of it happening?

They have. But it won't stop her from banging on about it.

The interesting thing is that whilst support for the SNPs has surged again, I'm not sure support for independence has. Imagine the look on their faces if there was indyref #2 and they lost AGAIN.

Same old shit.

"So what is the alternative proposal?"

"We dont know, but it has to be better than this eh?"

"Erm. This sounds like brexit pish. Tell me what the proposal is."

"Well we dont know, but hey - it has to be better than this eh? Erm. FREEDOM!"

"FFS"

It's the Gibraltar / Falklands tactic isn't it?

Distracts from the fecking awful mess they've made up there in the last 12y

What we need in this thread is Zedleg.

Nah, I’ve already had my argument for this week.

I’ll save it for when some thing more than broccers attention seeking happens .

ZedLeg wrote: ↑Sat Dec 21, 2019 10:14 am Nah, I’ve already had my argument for this week.

I’ll save it for when some thing more than broccers attention seeking happens .

Excellent no more replies in my threads - what a christmas gift.

As for the subject I read this this morning - https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/c ... -1-5065541

The challenge for pro-Union politicians is to stop pro-independence parties from winning a majority of seats at the 2021 Holyrood election. The challenge for the Scottish Government is to ditch the constant division and fix Scotland’s many problems, writes Brian Wilson.

Whenever I hear Nicola Sturgeon purporting to speak for “the people of Scotland”, there is one consolation – for every Scot who answers her definition, at least one more is turned off even further by this rhetoric.

Like any politician, Ms Sturgeon speaks for herself and her party. Nobody else. In the recent election, slightly more than one-third of Scots voted for non-separatist parties. Slightly fewer than one-third voted for the Nationalists. And one-third didn’t vote at all.

Her claim is further diluted by 25 per cent saying they voted tactically, including many incited to do so by the same Sturgeon assuring them their votes would not be claimed for either referendum or independence. Even by her own brazen standards, the volte face on that one has been spectacular.......

Surely no one voted SNP not knowing they were voting for IndyRef2. I just don’t believe that. She was very clear on it, I thought.

I think the article writer explains it clearly enough Dave. To assume is a route to failure - see Labour

Well, he claims she’s done a volte face on the subject when she very clearly hasn’t. Whatever reasons people had for either voting for the SNP or voting tactically to enable the SNP into power, the SNP pushing for IndyRef2 was always an inevitable and extremely obvious and explicit outcome. Anyone claiming otherwise is a moron.

Going back to Simons post right near the beginning, it does seem bonkers to want to split off before we’ve seen how NI get on with the Brexit dealings. I guess Scotland figures that once they’ve left it’ll be hard to get back in.

Oh yeah, it’s fucking mental. But unlike Brexit, I completely understand the desire.

The Scotsman is a Union mouthpiece and has been for years. My very middle class parents even jacked it after reading it for 60 years so don't think that is the opinion of the Scottish People.

I find it extraordinary that anyone who supported Brexit to "get out from under" doesn't at least understand where the Indy urge comes from. We overwhelmingly reject Tory rule again and again and we get stuck with one of the worst PMs and parties in history. Election promises are falling like dominoes, un-elected cabinet members.

I think Sturgeon had to make the declaration. The more Scots see how they are held in contempt by Johnson and his cabinet of millionaire lying bastards, the more people will lean towards Indy.

Sadly, with the Tories and the "better Together" campaigns having happily flouted rules on funding and who donates money, unless something radical happens then we know the social media war is gong to be as underhanded as the last one.

I hope voting lag doesn't put people off though.

You can counter most of the arguments from Westminster with their own stats tbh but who can be fucking bothered.

Had a vote. Decided to stay. The end.

Not that hard unless you want to be PM of Scotland and don't pretend she cares for anyone apart from herself.

I _understand_ why they feel pissed off, when they were told the only way to stay in the EU was to stay in the UK.

BUT, I don't think they realise the consequences if they decided to leave. It's not all sunny uplands.

And I didn't hear them complain when they had a Scottish PM in Westminster. England didn't push to leave the UK just because of the one-eyed idiot. Plus the lack of EVEL, the Barnett formula, etc etc.

Just devolve a little more power to them and stop this separatist nonsense.

The thing is that Westminster will never devolve anymore without the threat of us breaking away completely.

I’ve always said that my ideal would be a more federalised arrangement between all the constituents of the UK but Westminster has no motive to work towards that unless the devolved countries makes some noise.

Fail.

Got pished, couldn’t help myself .