OV9

GG. wrote: Thu Oct 24, 2024 12:33 pm There is a pretty high level of churn in law so we are generally always recruiting associates. It isn't all that often that someone doesn't pass probation or has it extended but it has happened. Our expectations of performance are high though, as you would expect.

Presumably also losing them/culling them when they don't perform after a couple of years too? Seemed pretty common to have friends suddenly not come back when I worked in London.

I think it generally becomes apparent pretty quickly and probation would be extended and then a decision made. Its rarer that someone that has been here a number of years is put on a performance improvement scheme, though again, that has happened to a few individuals as well. More often than not people get the message and decide they'd be better off elsewhere.

Our colleagues across the pond are more "pro-active" on putting people on more frequent assessments (which is essentially a precursor to a formal performance improvement plan) and the 360 review from other (slightly) more senior colleagues of theirs sometimes really don't hold back!

Our company has a pretty thorough interview process already where you have to complete and present a written exercise, plus another PowerPoint about stuff to do with your previous career. Takes 1.5hrs (plus I'd say quite a few hrs prep if you want to do a good job), plus a 30min screening interview with HR before that. All interviews are recorded and reviewed by a director and at least one other.

It's a PITA both as an interviewee, and I'm now on the interviewer/reviewer roster too which is an even bigger PITA.

Even so, we have dropped a few people after probation, we are fairly ruthless in that regard it seems, but we're a small company and as a consultant people are our commodity. So I guess we can't afford to carry dead weight or get it wrong too often for lots of reasons including reputational damage.

Before that all my previous interviews were all with contractors, which usually involved a vague chat to make sure you were alive and your CV wasn't all lies. That was always followed by an offer, and then you'd have to be really taking the piss to get sacked, they are terrified of it and seem quite happy to carry dead weight indefinitely.

I see all your problems finding good employees and raise you attempting to find bathroom fitters. You’ll get 500 cv’s of which only 30 have relevant experience, have to go off what they say they’re capable of, offer someone a job who will change their mind, give second choice the job and then find out they need so much time to get them up to speed (which makes your work about 5 times harder) then just as you’re getting somewhere they leave, and then start again

Mechanical fitter? No this is a fucking bunch of fucking carpet fitters.

At A and P Tyne when asking for a fitter to bend some pipes up for me as I was swamped .

Dave!

My interview was a 3 step process.

For Part 1, I had to create a presentation and then present it on a. my expected challenges in the first 3 months of employment and b. what success looked like after 12 months. I have 15 mins to create the presentation and 5 minutes to present

Part 2 was a Roll Play exercise. I had to take the roll of a General Manager who's Sales Manager, who had recently been promoted from salesman, was still working on the sales floor annoying the other sales people - I guess this was conflict resolution

Final part was a more traditional Questions and Answers type interview.

But at NO point was my previous work, my experience etc discussed.

I’ve never gone through a particularly taxing interview process tbh.

This job was an interview with my line manager and a second interview with one of the directors. I had to do an aptitude test but I don’t think anyone even looked at it.

My last job was weird, I went in to meet the director on a Saturday morning after being invited at 11pm the night before. Chatted about music and comics for like an hour and I started on the next monday

My interviews were fairly casual chats - i’d already done the role for 2 of their competitors for several years each so the assumption is i can do the mechanics of the job.

i’ve had one guy who interviewed well, had done a similar role for another company and was generally very good (he even jumped on a train from manchester to london to come and see us rather than waiting for me to go up there the next week.)

Anyway, he turned out to be basically retarded on even the most simple task on excel, wouldn’t make notes when i was training him and generally was nothing like the guy we interviewed. I got rid of him at the end of his probation.

Perkins apprentiship.

- an interview, different aptitude tests. Build a pressure relief valve, wire a plug following instructions, lay out a spares list for a job. Then you had a team working exercise and a final interview with the super boss. Around 60 got to this interview stage and 8 were employed as apprentices.

Aggreko international.

- An interview in Peterborough (they set up interviews near all the engine plant areas of the country) then a week long interview in Dubai, psychometric testing, a stress test which was just loads of people asking questions during a written test. A day working on one of the engines, then a day out with the service manager which was half selling you being in Dubai. A few hundred applied, 10 went to Dubai and 3 got employed.

Rolls-Royce

- I was employed by a contractor called ABC diesels who RR used to test out candidates. I asked to only go on RR jobs and did 7 weeks in Sudan doing a crank repair with 2 guys. When I got back they vouched for me, I was offered a full time job and ABC were given 3 months wages as payment.

Rolls-Royce Norway.

- they knew me as I’d done jobs for them. I got incredibly tired of working for the Dunfermline office as they treat you like shit. Phones up RR Norway and said let me come and interview with you and if a job comes available then keep me in mind. A colleague wanted to do the same so we went over together. After the interview and before getting to the car park they rang us up and made 2 jobs available.

The Dubai one was hard but getting someone who can’t perform is too much of a risk with so much expensive kit involved.

Dave!

Yeah I'd guess there's not much room for blagging in your line of work...

I'll also throw in the importance of team fit, which can be hard to predict.

I remember a job where I used a new plasterer/painter. He was a nice enough guy, perfectly competent, and I'd seen his work before. But he and the site manager ended up shouting and swearing at each other in Polish for the entire 3 week duration of the job, making the work atmosphere unpleasant for everyone, and having a generally detrimental effect on productivity.

It's simple for me because all the guys are subs rather than employees, so I just didn't use him again (I doubt he would have come back even if I'd asked) but I can imagine the same situation being a nightmare if they were employees.

Rich B wrote: Fri Oct 25, 2024 10:38 am
i’ve had one guy who interviewed well, had done a similar role for another company and was generally very good (he even jumped on a train from manchester to london to come and see us rather than waiting for me to go up there the next week.)

Anyway, he turned out to be basically retarded on even the most simple task on excel, wouldn’t make notes when i was training him and generally was nothing like the guy we interviewed. I got rid of him at the end of his probation.

We've had this this twice now. It's bloody frustrating

Tenuous link, especially after Labour suspended the person, but best place to post this

https://news.sky.com/video/share-13243645

The big question is how hard are Labour going in on landlords in the autumn budget? Either very hard, or exceptionally hard.

Gavster wrote: Tue Oct 29, 2024 7:30 am The big question is how hard are Labour going in on landlords in the autumn budget? Either very hard, or exceptionally hard.

I don't see how there's much meat on the bone to tax with landlords now, to be honest. I think divdend tax is going to be the big hit, so shareholders will be hammered.

It’s looking like it’s going to be CGT, employer’s NIC, maybe IHT and some fiddling with pension contributions.

Landlords are fleeing so rents have gone up noticeably in the last couple of months or so

The whole idea that landlords are "not working people" makes me think that they'll go hard on CGT for non-primary residences, because it's the capital appreciation which is the only meat remaining for landlords in some areas now.

Indeed... remember ALL landlords are loaded - I mean they must be. they have enough spare cash to own 2 houses...

Jobbo wrote: Tue Oct 29, 2024 9:22 am

Gavster wrote: Tue Oct 29, 2024 7:30 am The big question is how hard are Labour going in on landlords in the autumn budget? Either very hard, or exceptionally hard.

I don't see how there's much meat on the bone to tax with landlords now, to be honest. I think divdend tax is going to be the big hit, so shareholders will be hammered.

That’s me fucked

Dave!