OV9

I'm surprised the traditional petrol stations haven't made more of an effort tbh. If what they say is true and they only make a few pence per litre profit on petrol/diesel then there's going to be way more profit on electricity. Ok it takes 10 times longer to charge an EV vs refuelling but the Shell stations are selling electricity at over 80p per kwh and then you have a whole 30 minutes to sell overpriced shite to people at the forecourt.

jamcg wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 7:10 am It’s only zero tax for another 2 years so no point doing it now

https://www.carwow.co.uk/news/6492/elec ... lsrc=aw.ds

"But it’s not just new EVs that will have to pay road tax from 2025: electric cars first registered from April 2017 will have the £165 fee applied to them retrospectively, ending the exemption they had previously benefited from."

About time.

Electric cars do more damage to roads (heavier) than their petrol/diesel equivalents.

It was a temporary incentive, it was obviously not possible to last forever.

Simon wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 9:24 pm About time.

Electric cars do more damage to roads (heavier) than their petrol/diesel equivalents.

It was a temporary incentive, it was obviously not possible to last forever.

Got any evidence to back that statement up? I keep reading it, along with excess tyre wear and brake dust, I've yet to see any actual convincing research to back it up.

They're heavier yes, but not massively, and the tyres are rated and pressured to suit the weight. As for the brakes, they rust from lack of use, so quite where the brake dust argument comes from boggles the mind.

Agree on the VED coming through, no one expected it to go on for long.

Barry wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 9:53 pm

Simon wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 9:24 pm About time.

Electric cars do more damage to roads (heavier) than their petrol/diesel equivalents.

It was a temporary incentive, it was obviously not possible to last forever.

Got any evidence to back that statement up? I keep reading it, along with excess tyre wear and brake dust, I've yet to see any actual convincing research to back it up.

They're heavier yes, but not massively, and the tyres are rated and pressured to suit the weight. As for the brakes, they rust from lack of use, so quite where the brake dust argument comes from boggles the mind.

Agree on the VED coming through, no one expected it to go on for long.

Not interested in the tyres and brakes factors so much, but from a weight perspective an EQA is over 500kg heavier than an equivalent GLA, same for EQC over GLC etc. That 500kg is gonna do more damage to the roads, it's just counting.

VED has nothing to do with roads though. It's a vehicle tax.

So how much damage any vehicle does is irrelevant. Although I do agree they should be charged in congestion areas at least.

Would be good if that ved was set aside and used to drastically upgrade the weak link that is the charging network, which is what puts most people off going for ev’s. But it won’t…………

Swervin_Mervin wrote: Sat Jan 14, 2023 1:24 am VED has nothing to do with roads though. It's a vehicle tax.

So how much damage any vehicle does is irrelevant. Although I do agree they should be charged in congestion areas at least.

But Osborne, many years ago, ring fenced VED to pay for the roads, so it kinda does have something to do with them.

Simon wrote: Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:23 am

Swervin_Mervin wrote: Sat Jan 14, 2023 1:24 am VED has nothing to do with roads though. It's a vehicle tax.

So how much damage any vehicle does is irrelevant. Although I do agree they should be charged in congestion areas at least.

But Osborne, many years ago, ring fenced VED to pay for the roads, so it kinda does have something to do with them.

Only if they stuck to their promise/decision which isn't exactly their strong suit.

Simon wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 10:42 pm

Barry wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 9:53 pm

Simon wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 9:24 pm About time.

Electric cars do more damage to roads (heavier) than their petrol/diesel equivalents.

It was a temporary incentive, it was obviously not possible to last forever.

Got any evidence to back that statement up? I keep reading it, along with excess tyre wear and brake dust, I've yet to see any actual convincing research to back it up.

They're heavier yes, but not massively, and the tyres are rated and pressured to suit the weight. As for the brakes, they rust from lack of use, so quite where the brake dust argument comes from boggles the mind.

Agree on the VED coming through, no one expected it to go on for long.

Not interested in the tyres and brakes factors so much, but from a weight perspective an EQA is over 500kg heavier than an equivalent GLA, same for EQC over GLC etc. That 500kg is gonna do more damage to the roads, it's just counting.

I know what your getting at but it's not a direct correlation either. EV are far gentler on tyres, which will offset the weight penalty to some degree, for instance. It's acceleration and braking doing most of the damage.

I can’t back this up but my friend who builds roads said something along the lines that when the structural capacity of a road is calculated they don’t even take into account light traffic as it’s negligible wear. It’s all based off how many pairs of HGV axles will pass along it.

Mito Man wrote: Sat Jan 14, 2023 1:46 pm I can’t back this up but my friend who builds roads said something along the lines that when the structural capacity of a road is calculated they don’t even take into account light traffic as it’s negligible wear. It’s all based off how many pairs of HGV axles will pass along it.

It’s the weight on the axle and the time the road can recover between compressions I believe.

Car weight in general is stupid, I don’t understand how things are staying so heavy.

Dave!

More gentle on their tyres, or the tyres wear less because they’re super eco friendly low rolling resistance and seem to spend most of their time gently meandering along?

Surely lower rolling resistance usually means a smaller contact patch which combined with more weight is going to put more pressure on the road surface?

Not trying to start an arguement, and if what mito says is correct probably doesn’t matter a jot anyway, just thinking through the physics.

Gentler due to the way they're generally used I suspect yes, but I'm not buying the contact patch argument much, I bet there's barely measurable differences there. The low end stuff like mine runs on eco tyres (Mich Exalto iirc) but the sporty end running decent tyres these days too. I'm not looking for argument either, just interested in why the EV negatives are always the same little points.

Simon wrote: Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:23 am

Swervin_Mervin wrote: Sat Jan 14, 2023 1:24 am VED has nothing to do with roads though. It's a vehicle tax.

So how much damage any vehicle does is irrelevant. Although I do agree they should be charged in congestion areas at least.

But Osborne, many years ago, ring fenced VED to pay for the roads, so it kinda does have something to do with them.

Not quite the case. He made a pledge which was then re-pledged in 2018 by Hammond. VED between 2020-2025 was supposed to be ringfenced to go to National Highways. NH only maintain the Strategic Route Network. No idea though whether it ever was ringfenced given the shitstorm of the last few years.

All other roads are maintained from Local Highway Authority budgets.

Tesla dropped new prices on the Model 3 and Model Y by quite a bit yesterday, average 11%ish.

Yeah, recent Tesla buyers are not happy about it

ZedLeg wrote: Sun Jan 15, 2023 12:22 am Yeah, recent Tesla buyers are not happy about it

Erm. Surely understandably?

First looked at a ModelY years ago when we had the Disco4 - but we sniggered as it was £160k. I reckon you could get the same car now for less than £80k new…..

mik wrote: Sun Jan 15, 2023 12:34 am

ZedLeg wrote: Sun Jan 15, 2023 12:22 am Yeah, recent Tesla buyers are not happy about it

Erm. Surely understandably?

First looked at a ModelY years ago when we had the Disco4 - but we sniggered as it was £160k. I reckon you could get the same car now for less than £80k new…..

I mean I guess, maybe years of working in retail has hardened me against people complaining about good deals they missed .

It’s fucking hilarious, twitter is just full of narcissistic arseholes complaining now

She’s not a billionaire but must be pretty well off anyway

I guess this is one problem with having everything online and no negotiating. If it were one of the German brands you’d get the salesman such air through their teeth and just give £7000 off or whatever it is and no one else would know about it