Bye Bye Sunak..

[ZedLeg]

I’m not against VAT on uni fees if they’re going to be private school fees.

[dinny_g]

and add 20% to the long term debt that saddles most graduating students ??

What a marvelous idea.

[Rich B]

and add 20% to the long term debt that saddles most graduating students ??

What a marvelous idea.

to be fair, that's a tiny fraction of the debt that's been piled on students in the last 20 years. It's now been made "normal" to leave uni with £40-50k of debt.

[dinny_g]

Yeah but if they can afford £50k to go to Uni then they can afford another £10k

It is a luxury after all.

[Rich B]

Yeah but if they can afford £50k to go to Uni then they can afford another £10k

It is a luxury after all.

i don't think most can afford the £50k tbh. I seriously doubt many could if they had to pay it upfront.

It's not treated as real money - just an "easily afforded low interest loan that they might not even have to pay back".

I think uni should be free again like normal school is.

[DeskJockey]

Yeah but if they can afford £50k to go to Uni then they can afford another £10k

It is a luxury after all.

i don't think most can afford the £50k tbh. I seriously doubt many could if they had to pay it upfront.

It's not treated as real money - just an "easily afforded low interest loan that they might not even have to pay back".

I think uni should be free again like normal school is.

Very much this.

[Simon]

That only works if you reduce the number of students to the same as when it was free as well, else it's ridiculous.

Alternatively make certain important and required degrees free, like nursing etc.

[Rich B]

That only works if you reduce the number of students to the same as when it was free as well, else it's ridiculous.

Alternatively make certain important and required degrees free, like nursing etc.

I'm only countering Dinnys argument about uni being a luxury.

there's a whole other discussion to be had about the reality of uni courses.

[V8Granite]

When my Uncle went to Uni it was only the clever and hard working.

When I left school, everyone who stayed on got into uni and most were fuckwits with shit grades.

Dave!

[Rich B]

When my Uncle went to Uni it was only the clever and hard working.

When I left school, everyone who stayed on got into uni and most were fuckwits with shit grades.

Dave!

what does your uncle do?

[dinny_g]

I'm only countering Dinnys argument about uni being a luxury.

You do realise I was taking the piss, right?

[Rich B]

I'm only countering Dinnys argument about uni being a luxury.

You do realise I was taking the piss, right?

you were trying to make a point by being facetious, so I answered it. Nothing wrong with that?

[dinny_g]

Fair enough

By way of an apology, I give you this…

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcjnGxK/

[GG.]

Yeah but if they can afford £50k to go to Uni then they can afford another £10k

It is a luxury after all.

i don't think most can afford the £50k tbh. I seriously doubt many could if they had to pay it upfront.

It's not treated as real money - just an "easily afforded low interest loan that they might not even have to pay back".

I think uni should be free again like normal school is.

Even that is now out of date. The interest rates have been revised to be inflation linked - they're currently sat at 7%. This is a scandal in its own right, let alone increasing that principal by another 20% sat at 7% for decades.

Newly graduated students are now actually better off refinancing it with a cheaper unsecured bank loan.

[Rich B]

Fair enough

By way of an apology, I give you this…

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcjnGxK/

which is utterly insane.

[dinny_g]

It’s the thought process he went through before trying it for the first time

Hmmmm I wonder…

[Carlos]

I appreciate you move in different circles to me but a £50k unsecured loan for a recent graduate would be a stretch for any lender. That's before you calculate the monthlies and meet affordability at circa a grand a month for 60 months

Private Schooling and University are not comparable in my eyes. Going to University has massive financial barriers already particularly for those of lower income households.

[GG.]

I appreciate you move in different circles to me but a £50k unsecured loan for a recent graduate would be a stretch for any lender. That's before you calculate the monthlies and meet affordability at circa a grand a month for 60 months

Private Schooling and University are not comparable in my eyes. Going to University has massive financial barriers already particularly for those of lower income households.

Yes I was really aiming that at someone that goes into a professional city career like law, accounting, etc. and will actually pay the amount off rather than have it written off (apparently over 80% will have some amount written off which basically makes this a 30 year hypothecated tax on graduates).

I think 25k is likely the most you'd typically be able to borrow in any event but you could reduce the long term interest burden by doing that process in stages. Anyway, as someone that got a loan but before fees trebled (and only ever paid minimal interest) it is a depressing prospect for future kids, including my son. It then puts even more impetus on me to pay the fees - again these taxes / charges are all regressive as those with the least money / family money are the ones that will suffer.

The point about private schooling and university is that they are both fee paying and in reality you can argue tertiary education is not "necessary" and should afford you a higher income in later life (that's in theory of course... but also applies to private schools) so why not VAT it?

To be clear - I am not advocating for this! I think there is barely a single tax in the UK today you could credibly argue should be higher than it is currently - other than inexplicably, gambling which does not attract VAT.

[IanF]

All education should be tax free… and I don’t just say that cos the combined term bill last Easter was over 40k! (One in uni this term and only one full-time boarding now so.. ) Nor because after uni, my pilot licence was £120k (inc VAT) with no guarantee of the money being safe (3 schools have gone bankrupt this year alone, CAA won’t protect the money so trainee pilots have typically lost 30-60k!) or having a job to service the debt upon completion of the course. No delay reason is accepted after completion.. the stress to get a job with that debt piled on your head in intense, but we all love the job we end up doing.. doesn’t make VAT on it right though.

VAT wouldn’t affect the wealthy - a charitable donation is made when the child enters year 1 senior of eg. ~£250k at CLC for full boarding, which is/was deductible (charity donation), avoids any fee increases over the next 7 years, and can be gifted from grandparents directly (or trust) to avoid IHT; so lots of wealthy families wont see any difference. It’s the people who sacrifice holidays/nice cars etc so their child(ren) can get into a school that they deem necessary for whatever reason that would suffer.

I imagine people would firstly see if they can pay before the rule changed.. maybe the schools would agree a payment plan for A-Levels at a flat rate so there’s no “term-ly” fees any more.. and inevitably, some kids would be removed from the school they are happy and settled in sadly..

So in my example above, I’d have to have found an extra £2kpcm NET to pay the fees of three kids (more cos third child wants to board during A-levels, so 30kpa.) That would hurt but I’m not looking for any sympathy.. our decision etc

[duncs500]

I never contemplated sending ours to private school, I had the good fortune to go to a good state school which stood me in good stead. However, with my sister's kids having started school in recent years, the more I find out about the level of state schools at the moment the more I think we might be forced to go for a private one. Not a decision we need to make yet, but it really seems like it might be something you have to do if you can even remotely afford it. As such, I hope it doesn't get more expensive as it might price me out.