OV9

mik wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 11:34 am Pray for Cressida.

Katie Hopkins take on this is bril

I bet it isn’t

It’s basically that Cressida is a privileged, privately educated brat, which frankly may well be 100% true.

So’s Katie Hopkins

Anyone else look at that pic and can’t figure out who the daughter is and who the mother is?

Anna and Phoebe are facing the same judge this week as the M25 lot. However, I hope he goes light on them, they really don’t deserve a custodial sentence, the impact of their actions is fundamentally benign compared to the M25 lot.

Nope - completely disagree.

No matter their good intentions, people need to be discouraged from these sorts of acts of cultural violence. It's not benign... AT ALL. They didn't succeed this time due to safety glass but eventually, something of important cultural heritage will be destroyed forever. As a society, this cannot be allowed that to happen.

Yes we need to change our attitudes to the environment but these sorts of shock tactics aren't and won't work so they need to be eliminated by the threat of the law.

And, and I know this isn't a popular opinion but Just Stop Oil need to do better and work harder at convincing the public of their message. Work within societies conventions.

Were there any Just Stop Oil candidates in the recent General Election ? Why not ?

Mito Man wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 1:13 pm Anyone else look at that pic and can’t figure out who the daughter is and who the mother is?

Just Stop Oil of Olay.

dinny_g wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 6:12 pm
And, and I know this isn't a popular opinion but Just Stop Oil need to do better and work harder at convincing the public of their message. Work within societies conventions.

Were there any Just Stop Oil candidates in the recent General Election ? Why not ?

i would have thought that was a very popular opinion tbh.

this whole approach of “do something dumb that pisses off normal people, to get media attention to try and appeal to those normal people” just doesn’t work.

getting news time then squandering it by just saying “the world is going to die, just read these 3 books to explain why” is just wasting all the effort they’ve made. like you say - try the right channels first.

Rich B wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 7:31 pm

dinny_g wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 6:12 pm
And, and I know this isn't a popular opinion but Just Stop Oil need to do better and work harder at convincing the public of their message. Work within societies conventions.

Were there any Just Stop Oil candidates in the recent General Election ? Why not ?

i would have thought that was a very popular opinion tbh.

this whole approach of “do something dumb that pisses off normal people, to get media attention to try and appeal to those normal people” just doesn’t work.

getting news time then squandering it by just saying “the world is going to die, just read these 3 books to explain why” is just wasting all the effort they’ve made. like you say - try the right channels first.

“Just stop oil”

“Why?”

“Do your own research”

It’s ok, we run out of oil in 8 years.

Dave!

jamcg wrote: Wed Jul 24, 2024 7:55 am

Rich B wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 7:31 pm

dinny_g wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 6:12 pm
And, and I know this isn't a popular opinion but Just Stop Oil need to do better and work harder at convincing the public of their message. Work within societies conventions.

Were there any Just Stop Oil candidates in the recent General Election ? Why not ?

i would have thought that was a very popular opinion tbh.

this whole approach of “do something dumb that pisses off normal people, to get media attention to try and appeal to those normal people” just doesn’t work.

getting news time then squandering it by just saying “the world is going to die, just read these 3 books to explain why” is just wasting all the effort they’ve made. like you say - try the right channels first.

“Just stop oil”

“Why?”

“Do your own research”

This exposes the lie of mainstream discourse on oil in general.

On one hand “everyone knows we need to do something” on the other hand that ^

dinny_g wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 6:12 pm Nope - completely disagree.

No matter their good intentions, people need to be discouraged from these sorts of acts of cultural violence. It's not benign... AT ALL. They didn't succeed this time due to safety glass but eventually, something of important cultural heritage will be destroyed forever. As a society, this cannot be allowed that to happen.

Yes we need to change our attitudes to the environment but these sorts of shock tactics aren't and won't work so they need to be eliminated by the threat of the law.

And, and I know this isn't a popular opinion but Just Stop Oil need to do better and work harder at convincing the public of their message. Work within societies conventions.

Were there any Just Stop Oil candidates in the recent General Election ? Why not ?

By their very nature protests need to contain some element of disturbance, but the outcome of this attack was relatively inconsequential. They're not facing a trial based on "what if...", they're facing a trial based upon the fact they put some soup on picture frame and some glass, which caused a very small amount of damage. I think the message has already been sent that if you really fuck with people's lives (e.g. M25 protests) then you're going to jail.

JSO protests aren't great at getting people on board, you're right that they aren't gaining sympathy through them. They really should re-think them. But they need to tread that delciate line. Chaining yourself to a railing or going on a hunger strike doesn't effect anyone else but is a very significant protest.

Besides, protests are largely done to satisfy the ego of those protesting. It's exceptionally rare for protests to have an effect on public policy. It's Ghandi, Rosa Parks and Emmeline Pankhurst rare.

they’re fully aware of the sentencing guidelines before they carry out any of their stunts, they are also aware that those in charge will have to make an example of them to ensure they won’t be green lighting more stunts.

basically, they should all expect the max sentence for each crime and deal with it.

If they did a national broadcast and asked kids to walk to school more where possible, or walk to the shops it’s not going to change the world but it could very much change peoples mindsets.

Going for the hammer blow on everything is utterly retarded.

Dave!

I wouldn’t be surprised if they ended up with heavy sentences tbh.

Governments in general seem to be pushing this line that any type of disruptive protest is violence.

ZedLeg wrote: Wed Jul 24, 2024 9:20 am I wouldn’t be surprised if they ended up with heavy sentences tbh.

Governments in general seem to be pushing this line that any type of disruptive protest is violence.

I'm amazed JSO and XR (a lot of cross-membership and leadership IIRC) don't get more flack for being one of the main causes of the changes to anti-protest/public order laws, frankly. You'd think they'd get fucking pilloried for it.

Particularly given how Truss has turned out, now the mask has come off - a proper fucking nutcase who's cosying up to the 'abortions two months after birth' and 'gay marriage is the devils work' crowd. If she hadn't drawn up an economic plan that was beyond the pale even for late stage frothing Tories and had stayed in power, then what the fuck might we have needed robust right to protest for in that time?

New AG seems to be aware of it though, referencing 'abuse of secondary legislation' during their swearing in, which is how a lot of this stuff came to be law after failing to get through parliament proper, and is keen to talk to the civil rights charity Liberty, who took the Govt to the high court and basically won, causing Govt to have to quash the laws. Former Govt appealed it, new AG is up for negotiation of some sort apparently:
https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/news/court ... 33.article

I wouldn’t be surprised if they were being funded for that purpose tbh.

It’s why I’ve been wincing at everyone celebrating these heavy sentences. Even if you agree with them for JSO these new laws don’t bode well for future protests in general.

A bit too conspiratorial for me, but I'll concede that paying useful idiots to get unpopular laws passed 'organically' isn't outwith the realms of reality given the way the last government operated.

protest doesn’t seem to do a lot anyway these days. theres still war in gaza, there’s still new oil contracts, etc…