OV9

Seems to be like both major parties share the same vision with regards to UK food security

There is a clear trend that they’ve been not giving a crap about it since 1985 onwards

I think what they're all coming to realise (not just the UK but a lot of European countries as well) is that their primary duty is to ensure the stability, effective governance and defence of the country. That means supporting farming, defence, etc. over ideological goals such as climate change and biodiversity. All worthwhile aims but you can't have them prioritised to a point where you have vulnerabilities in domestic food or power supplies (which includes switching off north sea oil production).

There is obviously now a row back on some of this but too little too late.

Jobbo wrote: Wed Oct 28, 2026 8:45 am

dan wrote: Wed Oct 28, 2026 8:32 am I'll just pop round to my parents, there's always enough food to feed the entire street there.

Next Midlands meal at their house in the event of an apocalypse, yeah?

could comfortably accommodate the midlanders at least.

GG. wrote: Wed Oct 28, 2026 9:35 am Yes and really all this "you should be prepping" crap from the government is to try and push off some of the duty they have onto others. Its sensible in and of itself but you obviously get the feeling that they will not be doing their part.

Some part of it such as the tenuous nature of the electricity supply is completely a function of successive governments own infrastructure failures (and them allowing the planning system to become such a mess that anything that is built costs 3x what it should).

If people don't have stocks at home and the main supermarket distribution hubs got hacked and went down for a couple of days, then people will run out and clear the shelves of what is available "just in case". Having a few days buffer genuinely is a good strategy to reduce the level of panic buying, because those who did prepare are more likely to sit it out.

As for what's happening behind closed doors at a government level I'm not sure and would need to see if I can find out, but I can assure you that no politician on the planet actually wants to go out and tell people to stockpile food in case of shocks/attacks. It just creates panic and negative sentiment. If they could create resilient systems without giving that advice, then they would.

duncs500 wrote: Wed Oct 28, 2026 9:35 am Come on @Gavster, you're the only one who can save us, force the government to make some good policies!

I think the immediate aftermath of a major event is always rough, but in the medium/longer term supply chains and ways of life do adapt. If that means not eating bananas and tomatoes all year round, then I think people will soon get used to it, but for me there needs to be a level of basic production that (if we can manage the issue of getting it to hungry mouths) there is fundamentally enough to go round.

We can grow everything we need en masse, pineapples, tomatoes (you've all eaten my tomatoes, fnar fnar) and use much less land plus solve any energy issues without enormous transmission lines. All at 96% efficiency but engines bad so not allowed. The Dutch already do this.

We have such fertile wonderful land but dickheads who couldn't find the right side of a battery have ruined it in the name of climate bollocks.

Dave!

Mito Man wrote: Wed Oct 28, 2026 9:37 am Seems to be like both major parties share the same vision with regards to UK food security

There is a clear trend that they’ve been not giving a crap about it since 1985 onwards

If you cast your research back you'll see they really didn't give a crap (or in fact, we were arrogant) in the 1930s when british self sufficiency hit an all time low of around 30-40%. WWII and supply chains being destroyed by the nazis scared the hell out of us, so the post-war politicians that lived through WWII made a huge concerted effort to get self-sufficiency up. Between the 1930s and the 1980s our level of self sufficiency roughly doubled, which is a massive success, then there was a slight drop before stablising for the last 20 years.

I'd say that the peak in the 1980s was a historic anomaly, something we've not seen since pre-1850.

I also think it's crazy that people shout about self sufficiency in a country where bananas are the most popular fruit. Have you tried growing them recently? We are however far far closer to self sufficiency in the foods we are good at growing, such as meat, dairy, eggs, potatoes, carrots etc. Wheat is so-so because British wheat isn't strong enough for bread hence we import a fair amount.

I was at EJ Churchill yesterday, so Nef and I will be fine

Longer term, a shotgun is more useful than a stocked pantry. Even if you’re a bad shot, your neighbours don’t know that!

Why isn't wheat so good for bread?

We are milling our own wheat once I buy the machine and the bread maker folk rave about British wheat.

Dave!

UK wheat has lower protein (gluten) levels due to being a colder, wetter island, and our soil type, compared to mainland europe or other countries with warmer climates. That means that aside from the best British wheat, on average we would produce bread which is more denser and doesn't rise as much, which isn't what people enjoy eating.

There is a huge amount of British milled wheat, but far less 100% British grown wheat, and you live fairly close to where some of the best UK wheat is grown. Otherwise a lot of our wheat goes to animal feed.

Also, bear in mind that artisinal/home breadmakers will generally prioritise the best quality. However, most of the bread eaten in the UK is not artisinal/homemade.

Gav may be talking about british wheat varietals maybe rather than wheat grown in Britain because looking at the stats, 40% of our wheat production goes into making bread. Essentially you need a high enough protein percentage.

We are now importing a lot more wheat than we used to (but that may be partly down to quality issues for bread production given bad harvests) but also exporting much less. A lot of that is driven by reduction in farming subsidies and movement towards SFI initiatives where no-risk subsidies are given for basically rewilding.

ETA: post overlapped with Gav's but we seem to be saying essentially the same thing.

Gavster wrote: Wed Oct 28, 2026 11:01 am Also, bear in mind that artisinal/home breadmakers will generally prioritise the best quality. However, most of the bread eaten in the UK is not artisinal/homemade.

Aha much appreciated

We will get good wheat but I didn't realise on average it's relatively poor. It's only home made bread here, much better for taste but cost wise at best we break even.

Dave!