EV Thread

[JonMad]

The Nissan e-power hybrids are series ones too, all drive is from the electric motor. Not plug-in though and a small battery.

Interesting. Wonder how much it'll be running without the generator/engine involved and what the mpg will be like.

[simon_g]

Does pretty well apparently, 80+ mpg in normal driving.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/reviews/a3 ... 2090%20mpg.

https://driving.ca/reviews/road-test/5- ... te-e-power

When it comes to the Qashqai here next year it'll be the most powerful version, 190bhp and 330Nm. Seems a decent compromise for normal cars where people don't want a full BEV - drives like an EV (loads of torque), good in stop-start traffic, efficient on petrol.

[IanF]

Down in the wall of corn in the GF’s phev Evoque.

Journey down yesterday.. Windsor to past J13 M4 all elec through the 50-60 av speed zone then rest on the engine at 80 indicated. Battery completely dead after dropping off one child at Boardmasters and then off to Prot Gaverne/Isaac for night one.

Today.. No charging point at hotel (or nearby) but 30mins whilst at Tesco in Wadebridge added 28% to battery FoC (podpoint, which happens to be her provider at home so app already to go).. gives about 6 miles, but now we are on hills and stop start traffic (basically anything but clear motorway) and we’ve arrived after 1:20 journey near Plymouth with 15-20% battery. Hotel has three Tesla chargers so waiting for an XC90 to FO so I can plug the Evoque in. (Only one charger can be used by non-Teslas even though cable is the same )

I’ll provide total mpg after the journey home tomorrow, via Thurlestone Beachhouse, but I think it’s not really proven itself to be better than the derv version. Only real benefit is no Congestion Charge in London (this year at least)

TBC..

[dinny_g]

Hotel has three Tesla chargers so waiting for an XC90 to FO so I can plug the Evoque in.

This is one of my concerns and something that will need a solution for widespread adoption.

I live near Newport Pagnell Services and my evening bike ride route take me past the Tesla Charging point. On a Friday evening, there's often 6 parked up charging and at least 2 more waiting around, drivers pacing back and forth impatiently.

There has to be something in Autonomous driving mode - car unplugs and parks up by itself when it's finished etc. No charge points - no problem. Just park up and the car will drive itself up to the charge point when one becomes free etc.

[Jobbo]

I’ll provide total mpg after the journey home tomorrow, via Thurlestone Beachhouse, but I think it’s not really proven itself to be better than the derv version. Only real benefit is no Congestion Charge in London (this year at least)

Company car tax is doubtless a lot less with the PHEV. Without that carrot, I'm not sure there's any reason to buy one over a normal ICE car.

[IanF]

I’ll provide total mpg after the journey home tomorrow, via Thurlestone Beachhouse, but I think it’s not really proven itself to be better than the derv version. Only real benefit is no Congestion Charge in London (this year at least)

Company car tax is doubtless a lot less with the PHEV. Without that carrot, I'm not sure there's any reason to buy one over a normal ICE car.

It’s also the quickest Evoque 0-60 and will win tlgp’s against cars it shouldn’t. Torque fill is impressive up to 40ish mph.

Dinny- Elon has stated that Tesla chargers will be available for all “soon”. At the hotel, I used the standard Tesla charger to charge the ccs equipped Evoque. Interestingly, the Evoque has DC charging capability so will take 22kwh.. for 33miles range it does seem overkill, but obviously, when it comes to charging speed, the quicker the better.

[Carlos]

I like that though, it's not solely a phev to mitigate company car tax. I believe some of the Tesco chargers (your example) can charge at 22kwh which would give you a 30+mile range whilst you grab a case of Newqy Brown

[dinny_g]

Dinny- Elon has stated that Tesla chargers will be available for all “soon”.

True - For things like Hotel, Office etc , it will be relatively easy to manage - a few more charge stations, a message service put you in a queue to let you know when a charge point is available. If you're going out for the evening, Hotel Staff can move your car etc.

I still think Motorway Charging to allow for long range journeys is a massive issue to solve and I don't see as yet, any solid plans, short of turning every parking space into a charge station or really rapid charging - like to 80% in 3 or 4 minutes. This is key to widespread acceptance. There'll be widespread adoption, driven by legislation but widespread acceptance.

You cant realistically have effective public transport from any point in the country to any other point in the country so people are going to need to drive more than 200 miles in a single day. Unless, of course, in future, we can't which is a pretty sad.

Charge Parks where you park up your EV and head into the services - Autonomous driving mode drives your car up to the next available charge station and a robotic arm connects the charger. Once finished, autonomous driving mode parks it up and sends you a text with the location marked on Google Maps anyone ???

[Mito Man]

Hotel has three Tesla chargers so waiting for an XC90 to FO so I can plug the Evoque in.

This is one of my concerns and something that will need a solution for widespread adoption.

I live near Newport Pagnell Services and my evening bike ride route take me past the Tesla Charging point. On a Friday evening, there's often 6 parked up charging and at least 2 more waiting around, drivers pacing back and forth impatiently.

There has to be something in Autonomous driving mode - car unplugs and parks up by itself when it's finished etc. No charge points - no problem. Just park up and the car will drive itself up to the charge point when one becomes free etc.

The Tesla's parked up are still charging. When the superchargers are near capacity you can only charge to 80/90% depending on how busy to limit wait times. Also staying plugged in whilst not charging results in quite large "idle fees" which can ramp up to £1 per minute if the station is at capacity. The owners will have an alert on their phone once the car has 15 minutes, 10 minutes, 5 minutes etc until charging is complete.

[simon_g]

It's frustrating that Ecotricity did that initial land grab for MSAs and left them to rot for so long. So many people had a first experience of charging on a long motorway trip where the charger was knackered. Now that Gridserve have taken it over I'm much more hopeful about it.

Their initial replace of existing units is going at a decent pace, they're super easy to use (plug in, beep contactless card), they'll get updated very soon to do two cars at once, effectively doubling capacity. The next wave though will be sticking in a 6-12 extra units plus all the battery-backed grid stuff to support it.

It will mean more and more spaces dedicated to charging as more cars electrify. Rugby services opened this year with a dozen 350kw chargers for anyone, plus a dozen Tesla and everything in place to keep on adding more as they need.

I don't think 80% in 3-4 minutes is that relevant really unless you're needing to hang around next to the car. The motorway services get very busy with regular ICE drivers who want to stop and have a break - I think very few are taking less than 15-20 minutes to do that. Cars and chargers keep getting more capable in that regard - something like the new Ioniq 5 on a 350kw charger (like Ionity, or the ones at Rugby) will get 55kWh or 180ish miles of motorway range in that time. I'm sure there's some sales rep types who'll be doing 500 miles with nothing more than a petrol station sandwich eaten off their lap but most people need a break after a few hours.

[Swervin_Mervin]

It's frustrating that Ecotricity did that initial land grab for MSAs and left them to rot for so long. So many people had a first experience of charging on a long motorway trip where the charger was knackered. Now that Gridserve have taken it over I'm much more hopeful about it.

Their initial replace of existing units is going at a decent pace, they're super easy to use (plug in, beep contactless card), they'll get updated very soon to do two cars at once, effectively doubling capacity. The next wave though will be sticking in a 6-12 extra units plus all the battery-backed grid stuff to support it.

It will mean more and more spaces dedicated to charging as more cars electrify. Rugby services opened this year with a dozen 350kw chargers for anyone, plus a dozen Tesla and everything in place to keep on adding more as they need.

I don't think 80% in 3-4 minutes is that relevant really unless you're needing to hang around next to the car. The motorway services get very busy with regular ICE drivers who want to stop and have a break - I think very few are taking less than 15-20 minutes to do that. Cars and chargers keep getting more capable in that regard - something like the new Ioniq 5 on a 350kw charger (like Ionity, or the ones at Rugby) will get 55kWh or 180ish miles of motorway range in that time. I'm sure there's some sales rep types who'll be doing 500 miles with nothing more than a petrol station sandwich eaten off their lap but most people need a break after a few hours.

Edge case scenarios incoming in 5...4...3...

[dinny_g]

The Tesla's parked up are still charging. When the superchargers are near capacity you can only charge to 80/90% depending on how busy to limit wait times. Also staying plugged in whilst not charging results in quite large "idle fees" which can ramp up to £1 per minute if the station is at capacity. The owners will have an alert on their phone once the car has 15 minutes, 10 minutes, 5 minutes etc until charging is complete.

yeah, that all makes sense Mito - I'm not on the Electric Bandwagon yet so I don't really know the processes.- like idle fees etc.

[mik]

I'm not on the Electric Bandwagon yet so I don't really know the processes.

Even the bandwagons are electric now. And they call that “progress”

[dinny_g]

[Jobbo]

It's frustrating that Ecotricity did that initial land grab for MSAs and left them to rot for so long. So many people had a first experience of charging on a long motorway trip where the charger was knackered. Now that Gridserve have taken it over I'm much more hopeful about it.

Their initial replace of existing units is going at a decent pace, they're super easy to use (plug in, beep contactless card), they'll get updated very soon to do two cars at once, effectively doubling capacity. The next wave though will be sticking in a 6-12 extra units plus all the battery-backed grid stuff to support it.

It will mean more and more spaces dedicated to charging as more cars electrify. Rugby services opened this year with a dozen 350kw chargers for anyone, plus a dozen Tesla and everything in place to keep on adding more as they need.

I don't think 80% in 3-4 minutes is that relevant really unless you're needing to hang around next to the car. The motorway services get very busy with regular ICE drivers who want to stop and have a break - I think very few are taking less than 15-20 minutes to do that. Cars and chargers keep getting more capable in that regard - something like the new Ioniq 5 on a 350kw charger (like Ionity, or the ones at Rugby) will get 55kWh or 180ish miles of motorway range in that time. I'm sure there's some sales rep types who'll be doing 500 miles with nothing more than a petrol station sandwich eaten off their lap but most people need a break after a few hours.

Edge case scenarios incoming in 5...4...3...

Not really an edge case - plenty of people fill up their ICE cars at locations other than motorway services. Particularly in Norfolk, Suffolk, Dorset and Cornwall which don’t have any motorways. So the ability to add 180 miles of range in 15-20 mins isn’t all that useful unless it’s at every current petrol station, and facilities are added to make waiting less of a chore.

[integrale_evo]

Does it need edge cases?

On the odd occasion I’m doing a long run and stop at a services there seems to be a constant stream of people walking in, using the toilets then walking out and carrying on their journey, a far smaller proportion will grab a sandwich or a fast food to take out, even less will actually sit and hang around.

To assume that everyone stops for 15-20 mins is a bit of a stretch

[V8Granite]

Definitely that, with 2 kids we stop for less than 10 minutes and that doesn’t include the connecting to a charger etc.

Also we nearly always travel very early in the morning or late at night and will sit at speed. Chuck on a roof box or now a trailer and the range drop is huge. So less flexibility, longer journey times, not my idea of freedom. The only suitable one for range could be a Model X but the vehicle is simply too small.

I’m confident that the range and size issues will be sorted by the time it’s all pushed on us but I’m not convinced it will be as much freedom as we have now. Currently I do 450 miles on a fill with a roofbox, trailer etc. So call it 400 with some leeway. The only model X review I saw had it double the energy use when towing, so that’s 150 miles, just not there yet.

Now I get that people like to stop at services but when those same people are now charging their cars, it’s going to get very busy in the next few years. Plus I can’t see the costs dropping with more take up in it.

Just trying to enjoy the freedom and flexibility we have for how we travel for as long as possible.

Dave!

[Carlos]

I'm no EVangelist but you 2 sound like my dad

I don't think I've ever driven more than 200 miles without a break of some sort whether that's for a toilet stop, food, drink or just to stretch my legs and if you can do these things in less than 20 minutes particularly with a spouse, kids and dogs in tow it must be like a military operation

[MikeHunt]

I leased an iPace for 18 months for my wife. It was a really good deal (£420/month, zero deposit) and I was able to lease through my business so it was more or less paid for by the tax man.

When she first took delivery, in march 19 it was easy to charge. Longbridge , our local shops had circa 10 ev spaces, in Birmingham City centre spaces near the restaurants I like, space right outside the door at Ikea and all essentially free charging.

The problem is that as EVs became more common, it became more and more difficult to get a space and you definitely can it rely on charging your car. Also chargers aren't always reliable, its not uncommon for it to stop charging as soon as you walk away from your car.

A friend has a Tesla and its seems that they have much more availability of chargers and they are more reliable. Our local motorway services (M42 j2) is accessible without joining the motorway. He regularly visits for a free charge and has a group of "Tesla friends" who were meeting regularly pre pandemic to work from Starbucks while charging.

I was tempted by the recent deals on a Taycan, but I don't think that anything other than a Tesla is really an option until the charging network matures.

[Barry]

Everyone fixating on not adapting their driving to suit a small change in routine I see. You should be taking a 30 min break every 150/200 miles in this country, so that's plenty to top up a modern EV to do the same again

That said, there OP said daily sub 100 miles. Even my basic Ioniq will do that easily, without needing to touch the charging network. Charge at home each night.