Pfft, I didn't start this thread...Explosive Newt wrote: ↑Sun Dec 22, 2019 9:25 pmSounds like a zinger. Any ideas for your next thread to start? Maybe something less controversial? We should try and gather the forum’s views on Palestine.
Toilet definition
Re: Toilet definition
Re: Toilet definition
What if the man he was competing with, used to be woman?
The Evo forum really is a shadow of its former self. I remember when the internet was for the elite and now they seem to let any spastic on
IaFG Down Under Division
IaFG Down Under Division
Re: Toilet definition
One thing I've not understood and this seems like as good a thread to ask it in as anywhere...
LGBT representation in movies, especially those big Hollywood blockbusters, is one of the biggest topics online and has been for a few years now. But what do people want to see exactly?
If I'm going to the latest Avengers movie, I don't care what the characters' colour, background or sexual preference is. Unless its part of the story, I just don't care if Captain America is giving his ass to Black Panther in their downtime from saving the world.
So what does the movement want to see happen? Marvel have said a first transgender superhero is coming soon. But how's that going to translate to the big screen? How does the fact they're transgender going to be written-in to a movie in any way which isn't going to feel like they're paying lip service to them? Even a movie like Endgame which is 3 hours long had no padding in it. If there was a transgender hero on screen (which there might have been anyway), what sort of plot would they write-in which would let them shine in a relevant way?
or is it just the case that people want to see Marvel say that character x is transgender and you will see them saving the world in the next movie. Because I don't think that's going to satisfy things either.
LGBT representation in movies, especially those big Hollywood blockbusters, is one of the biggest topics online and has been for a few years now. But what do people want to see exactly?
If I'm going to the latest Avengers movie, I don't care what the characters' colour, background or sexual preference is. Unless its part of the story, I just don't care if Captain America is giving his ass to Black Panther in their downtime from saving the world.
So what does the movement want to see happen? Marvel have said a first transgender superhero is coming soon. But how's that going to translate to the big screen? How does the fact they're transgender going to be written-in to a movie in any way which isn't going to feel like they're paying lip service to them? Even a movie like Endgame which is 3 hours long had no padding in it. If there was a transgender hero on screen (which there might have been anyway), what sort of plot would they write-in which would let them shine in a relevant way?
or is it just the case that people want to see Marvel say that character x is transgender and you will see them saving the world in the next movie. Because I don't think that's going to satisfy things either.
Cheers,
Mike.
Mike.
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NotoriousREV
- Posts: 6437
- Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2018 4:14 pm
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When we read books or watch movies or TV shows we need to identify with characters in those stories to hook us in. There needs to be something which we latch on to as being like us in at least one character that shows that they're like us in some way. LGBT+ or non-white or female characters aren't necessarily for your benefit as a cis white hetero male.
For example, growing up, you could play at being Superman, or Spider-Man, beating the bad guys and getting the girl. You had a role model. If you were black, who were your role models on TV that were like you in some way? What if you were gay? A lot of gay or bi people knew they were gay or bi before they knew what sex really was, even if they didn't really understand it at the time. But media mainly showed hetero relationships so if you weren't hetero it added to making you feel different.
I think what people want is representation as normal. Ideally, it would be great to have characters that are whatever race and sexuality they are without it being a big deal. But it needs to be a big deal until it gets to the point where it isn't.
All IMHO, of course.
For example, growing up, you could play at being Superman, or Spider-Man, beating the bad guys and getting the girl. You had a role model. If you were black, who were your role models on TV that were like you in some way? What if you were gay? A lot of gay or bi people knew they were gay or bi before they knew what sex really was, even if they didn't really understand it at the time. But media mainly showed hetero relationships so if you weren't hetero it added to making you feel different.
I think what people want is representation as normal. Ideally, it would be great to have characters that are whatever race and sexuality they are without it being a big deal. But it needs to be a big deal until it gets to the point where it isn't.
All IMHO, of course.
Middle-aged Dirtbag
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Rev is correct.
Take my sarky comment about it being easy to say you don't care about people's, race, gender, sexuality whatever when you fit into what's considered the norm socially.
If you don't fit into that it can be incredibly isolating until you find more people like you. Which is why it's important to see people who are explicitly like you in the media you consume. They give you someone to identify with and these days can also act as something to help you into a larger culture of people like you on social media etc.
My favourite use of this type of representation recently was Bill in the first series of Killing Eve. He was a fairly no nonsense type of guy but also explicity, canonically bi.
I mean they did then kill him off for a cheap emotional moment which is another problematic trope in modern media but we can pick at that another time
.
Take my sarky comment about it being easy to say you don't care about people's, race, gender, sexuality whatever when you fit into what's considered the norm socially.
If you don't fit into that it can be incredibly isolating until you find more people like you. Which is why it's important to see people who are explicitly like you in the media you consume. They give you someone to identify with and these days can also act as something to help you into a larger culture of people like you on social media etc.
My favourite use of this type of representation recently was Bill in the first series of Killing Eve. He was a fairly no nonsense type of guy but also explicity, canonically bi.
I mean they did then kill him off for a cheap emotional moment which is another problematic trope in modern media but we can pick at that another time
.An absolute unit
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Is it a bird? 
Is it a plane?
No!
It’s SuperGenderFluidLongHairedCaucasianGlassesWearingSpeehimpedentFromWalesPerson!
Help us SuperGenderFluidLongHairedCaucasianGlassesWearingSpeehimpedentFromWa.... oh shit they’ve gone
Is it a plane?
No!
It’s SuperGenderFluidLongHairedCaucasianGlassesWearingSpeehimpedentFromWalesPerson!
Help us SuperGenderFluidLongHairedCaucasianGlassesWearingSpeehimpedentFromWa.... oh shit they’ve gone
Re: Toilet definition
[mention]ZedLeg[/mention] [mention]NotoriousREV[/mention] Oh absolutely, I totally agree with everything you've both said. And I think in books, comics and TV shows there's more space & time for writers to explore those themes, backstories, context etc. I just think it gives much more of a problem for writers in some of these mainstream action/sci-fi movies where if people aren't in to the extended universe and canon, there may be very limited opportunity for them to do this properly in the way it deserves.
Clearly the industry has had issues both in front-of and behind the camera - its slowly changing to reflect society (although at the same time mirroring many issues in society) - so in those examples, kids will see more women on-screen, more people from different ethnicities etc. I think its then an interesting challenge to bring sexuality in to that equation too in a way which isn't just seen as paying lip service to it.
Clearly the industry has had issues both in front-of and behind the camera - its slowly changing to reflect society (although at the same time mirroring many issues in society) - so in those examples, kids will see more women on-screen, more people from different ethnicities etc. I think its then an interesting challenge to bring sexuality in to that equation too in a way which isn't just seen as paying lip service to it.
Cheers,
Mike.
Mike.
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The problem is that any sort of representation will be decried as pandering or forced diversity by a very vocal crowd of arseholes. Especially in genre fiction.
Those types of fan only want what they want and anything else is wrong so it leads to a situation where you have to plant your flag and make a noise to counter it.
Look at the amount of shit Capt Marvel got or the harassment that pretty much everyone involved with the last jedi and the ghostbusters got.
It doesn’t help that some studios shit themselves when this happens and walk back anything the arseholes didn’t like.
Those types of fan only want what they want and anything else is wrong so it leads to a situation where you have to plant your flag and make a noise to counter it.
Look at the amount of shit Capt Marvel got or the harassment that pretty much everyone involved with the last jedi and the ghostbusters got.
It doesn’t help that some studios shit themselves when this happens and walk back anything the arseholes didn’t like.
An absolute unit
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You're damned if you do and damned if you don't...
The Zia Rodriguez character in the last Jurassic World movie was Gay but had various lines removed in edit so it was, in effect, not mentioned. And they got grief for it.
I loved Captain Marvel and think it's awesome that my Nieces have films like that to watch until they're old enough to Watch the Alien moves to see what a real Bad Ass woman looks like!!!
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I would say ignore the crybabies and make everything more diverse myself .
One of the good things about how the world works now is that there’s a lot more opportunity for artists outside of the mainstream to get their work seen so there is a much better scene for diverse pop culture now than even when I was growing up in the 90’s.
It’s just a shame that as soon as anyone gets a bit of traction and sticks their head over the mainstream parapet they have to deal with the same shitheads that have been gatekeeping pop culture for ever and most people understandably decide it’s not worth it.
.One of the good things about how the world works now is that there’s a lot more opportunity for artists outside of the mainstream to get their work seen so there is a much better scene for diverse pop culture now than even when I was growing up in the 90’s.
It’s just a shame that as soon as anyone gets a bit of traction and sticks their head over the mainstream parapet they have to deal with the same shitheads that have been gatekeeping pop culture for ever and most people understandably decide it’s not worth it.
An absolute unit
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I'm slowly turning into my grandfather and can't understand the need to pander to a minority - by all means do your thing but don't force the rest of the world to accept you and your requirements.
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Just to clear up any misunderstanding for an old man. Is is still OK to be a straight white male from the baby boom generation, or should I be feeling slightly ashamed of myself? 
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Won’t someone think of how the middle class, middle aged, white dudes are struggling .
The only time people have an issue with boomers and gen xers is when they talk nonsense like not being forced to accept minorities.
.The only time people have an issue with boomers and gen xers is when they talk nonsense like not being forced to accept minorities.
An absolute unit
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You’re the reason Australia is on fire and the planet is generally dying. Every time you fart a koala dies.
How about not having a sig at all?
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Brilliant.
Can people from McEthnic minority groups joke about this and it's ok? or am I (the member of non-minority group) a bad person for finding this funny.
