Harry’s Garage

[integrale_evo]

It’s the old £1500 to weld the cracks and add plates jobs I thought were massively overpriced for very simple work.

I mean I stripped the rear end off my e36 which is virtually identical to the e46 rear end on my back on a gravel drive with a Halfords trolley jack, it’s really basic easy stuff.

Stop drilling, welding, grinding, welding on plates isn’t exactly weeks worth of work either. Sure, some are way more involved depending how many other spot welds have pulled out.

General wisdom is that nowhere will do resin injection other than bmw. The current methods open up the inside of the floor and add a brace to tie the subframe mounting bolt bosses to the main chassis sections then welding the top back on.

Of course there’s always a lot of spec creep ‘while it’s all in bits’ for new bushes, brake pipes etc.

[Marv]

I mean I stripped the rear end off my e36 which is virtually identical to the e46 rear end on my back on a gravel drive with a Halfords trolley jack, it’s really basic easy stuff..

I wouldn't classify pulling the rear end off a car and doing a decent job of welding on plates as basic and easy to DIY, but if you say it is, then it must be

[Jobbo]

Does the cardboard boot floor cause any problems when welding?

[integrale_evo]

I mean I stripped the rear end off my e36 which is virtually identical to the e46 rear end on my back on a gravel drive with a Halfords trolley jack, it’s really basic easy stuff..

I wouldn't classify pulling the rear end off a car and doing a decent job of welding on plates as basic and easy to DIY, but if you say it is, then it must be

The welding bit isn’t for everyone, but the basic mechanics of unbolting the rear end is very straightforward for something which looks so major.

I’ve seen lots of redish vids and photos and their welding doesn’t look any more special than I’ve been doing for years with a basic £100 machinemart mig.

[integrale_evo]

Does the cardboard boot floor cause any problems when welding?

I expect it could if you didn’t take it out first

[Jimexpl]

Wasn't the CS basically a CSL with a manual ?

nah, the CSL had forged wheels, CF intake, CF roof, different bodywork, different boot floor, thin rear glass...

Different seats, different centre console without armrest, different door cards. Still think a manual CS would be the one I'd want; usability is one of the E46 M3's talents and the CSL isn't *that* light, yet seems quite compromised unless you're on it.

And a Z4M has the CSL exhaust manifold, brakes, steering rack and weighs within about 25kg of the CSL, but at a 1/3 of the price.

As good as CSLs are, I've never found them anywhere near as focussed as a drivers car when you compare what you can get for the same money. Today, unless you really need rear seats, something like a Cayman GTS would be where I'd spend my cash.

[Mito Man]

Z4Ms seem to be pretty difficult to drive fast though? I remember reading a few reviews saying they can snap pretty easily, not sure if it can be simply fixed with alignment and new suspension or whether it’s a more fundamental issue.

[GG.]

I remember top gear concluding that a Z4M is a significantly inferior car to a 987 Boxster S. On that logic we've just concluded that you'd be better off with a ten grand Boxster than a £60 grand CSL

To be honest if you had to have a SMG CSL versus a manual Boxster S it is probably a close run thing.

[ZedLeg]

I guess the thing is now that you're paying collector premium you'll get a CSL because you want a CSL. Might as well suggest a diesel Golf

Of course real connoisseurs have both, right @Marv ?

[Broccers]

You're paying for the noise which is what impressed me most about the csl.

I would like to see a review of a manual v10 m5, that might do something to their values in the future.

[RobYob]

You're paying for the noise which is what impressed me most about the csl.

I would like to see a review of a manual v10 m5, that might do something to their values in the future.

I've read less than stellar review of the US only manual E60 M5. Gearbox was from a dieseasel?

Anyway there's some articles like this.
https://jalopnik.com/what-its-really-li ... 1788425917

[integrale_evo]

You're paying for the noise which is what impressed me most about the csl.

I would like to see a review of a manual v10 m5, that might do something to their values in the future.

You can get exactly the same noise on any e46 m3 with approx £2k worth of carbon air box and a remap.

[Coaster1]

And a Z4M has the CSL exhaust manifold, brakes, steering rack and weighs within about 25kg of the CSL, but at a 1/3 of the price.

As good as CSLs are, I've never found them anywhere near as focussed as a drivers car when you compare what you can get for the same money. Today, unless you really need rear seats, something like a Cayman GTS would be where I'd spend my cash.

I didn’t know that (or more than likely I knew that but forgotten).

You're paying for the noise which is what impressed me most about the csl.

And the 110kg saving. That’s Ferrari 360CS level.

I love CSL, but admittedly not at its current price point.

[Jimexpl]

Z4Ms seem to be pretty difficult to drive fast though? I remember reading a few reviews saying they can snap pretty easily, not sure if it can be simply fixed with alignment and new suspension or whether it’s a more fundamental issue.

They're actually a safer setting from the factory, with a tendancy to understeer, so need a bit more provocation to oversteer in the dry, which is perhaps why the magazine say that they snap, but you need to be driving like a loon on the road for that to happen. It's common to apply the CSL alignment to them which you can match aside from a bit of -ve front camber without changing any components.
I had a Z4M roadster for a couple of years and did half a dozen track days and a Euro road trip. It never stepped out on me unless I was provoking it (CSL settings). I had a Boxster S Sport Edition on sports suspension afterwards and it was a far more precise and enjoyable road car.

[Broccers]

Z4Ms seem to be pretty difficult to drive fast though? I remember reading a few reviews saying they can snap pretty easily, not sure if it can be simply fixed with alignment and new suspension or whether it’s a more fundamental issue.

They're actually a safer setting from the factory, with a tendancy to understeer, so need a bit more provocation to oversteer in the dry, which is perhaps why the magazine say that they snap, but you need to be driving like a loon on the road for that to happen. It's common to apply the CSL alignment to them which you can match aside from a bit of -ve front camber without changing any components.
I had a Z4M roadster for a couple of years and did half a dozen track days and a Euro road trip. It never stepped out on me unless I was provoking it (CSL settings). I had a Boxster S Sport Edition on sports suspension afterwards and it was a far more precise and enjoyable road car.

I had a z4m roadster on loan when they were released. I didn't enjoy it much, my boxster is different level handling. Less urgent engine granted.

[Nathan]

You're paying for the noise which is what impressed me most about the csl.

I would like to see a review of a manual v10 m5, that might do something to their values in the future.

You can get exactly the same noise on any e46 m3 with approx £2k worth of carbon air box and a remap.

That's another thing, does carbon sound any different to plastic ?

Does it need to cost £2k ? Mudge had an intake on his Z4M that he rated

[integrale_evo]

Yes, carbon is stiffer so it’s laid thinner. Carbon air box also gets rid of the restrictive maf which in itself kills a lot of the noise.

An intake kit improves the noise which a lot of people are happy with but won’t get anything like the same bark as a proper wide mouth thin wall carbon air box.

I made a spare air box on my e36 look like Swiss cheese which released a load of noise ( on realoem the filter boxes are usually called intake silencers ) but I’m not going to pretend it’s close to a carbon intake, but it also only cost £15.

Everyone rates the eventuri which is basically a k&n cone in a fancy looking carbon shroud and cost £800. A proper carbon air box is on another level. £2k is a rough estimate, Geoff steel racing ones are cheaper and race proven but not the prettiest, others like evolve and karbonius are neater but more expensive. Depends if you need to pay someone to fit it too.

[mik]

That's another thing, does carbon sound any different to plastic ?

Does it need to cost £2k ? Mudge had an intake on his Z4M that he rated

It sounded great. Paging @Maurice

[Broccers]

You're paying for the noise which is what impressed me most about the csl.

I would like to see a review of a manual v10 m5, that might do something to their values in the future.

I've read less than stellar review of the US only manual E60 M5. Gearbox was from a dieseasel?

Anyway there's some articles like this.
https://jalopnik.com/what-its-really-li ... 1788425917

Ta

[Mito Man]

Yes, carbon is stiffer so it’s laid thinner. Carbon air box also gets rid of the restrictive maf which in itself kills a lot of the noise.

An intake kit improves the noise which a lot of people are happy with but won’t get anything like the same bark as a proper wide mouth thin wall carbon air box.

I made a spare air box on my e36 look like Swiss cheese which released a load of noise ( on realoem the filter boxes are usually called intake silencers ) but I’m not going to pretend it’s close to a carbon intake, but it also only cost £15.

Everyone rates the eventuri which is basically a k&n cone in a fancy looking carbon shroud and cost £800. A proper carbon air box is on another level. £2k is a rough estimate, Geoff steel racing ones are cheaper and race proven but not the prettiest, others like evolve and karbonius are neater but more expensive. Depends if you need to pay someone to fit it too.

This is a good excuse for a 3D printer, print a mould of the airbox, buy some sheets of carbon and the binding epoxy, and you have a carbon airbox, sell a few and profit
There’s a few chaps on YouTube who show the whole process and it’s fecking cool.