Bye Bye Boris!

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duncs500
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by duncs500 »

I haven't seen any evidence of an increase in abusive behavior towards immigrants. I've heard a few stories, but they're not different or more frequent from the ones I heard long before Brexit (for those that don't remember, my wife is Polish and so for the last 8 years I've been regaled with all her experiences and that of the people she knows).

I think there's a certain increased fear factor among immigrants from the EU due to Brexit, which perhaps might mean when something does happen they are more likely to attribute it to Brexit, but the idiots have always been there, I don't think there's suddenly a lot more of them. In fact, at the moment I'm lucky enough to work in a hugely diverse team of races and nationalities, and it's quite clear in my experience that we live in the most enlightened and tolerant era that I've ever known.
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Jobbo
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by Jobbo »

NotoriousREV wrote: Fri Aug 02, 2019 6:31 pm Do we think the reduction in Boris' majority will precipitate an early election? He's got zero chance of getting a deal through, surely?
He has a working majority of 1 when you include the DUP.

There are some Tory MPs who will actively vote against the Government and whip; Hammond, Grieve, Clarke etc. They aren’t going to be swayed easily and apparently there are 20 or so of them.

So he’s got zero chance of pushing anything through against the wishes of the House.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by Mito Man »

duncs500 wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2019 5:43 am I haven't seen any evidence of an increase in abusive behavior towards immigrants. I've heard a few stories, but they're not different or more frequent from the ones I heard long before Brexit (for those that don't remember, my wife is Polish and so for the last 8 years I've been regaled with all her experiences and that of the people she knows).

I think there's a certain increased fear factor among immigrants from the EU due to Brexit, which perhaps might mean when something does happen they are more likely to attribute it to Brexit, but the idiots have always been there, I don't think there's suddenly a lot more of them. In fact, at the moment I'm lucky enough to work in a hugely diverse team of races and nationalities, and it's quite clear in my experience that we live in the most enlightened and tolerant era that I've ever known.
Same, and I spent 7 months sleeping in a hospital chatting to nurses which were mostly from Eastern Europe and they didn’t mention any changes but the South East and London don’t care as much anyway as it’s all much more multicultural.
I’m a bit disappointed in the people who decided to pack bags and return to their home countries due to racism - the world would be a really sad place if everyone had that attitude and no equality rights would have been created in the first place.
How about not having a sig at all?
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NotoriousREV
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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Mito Man wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:19 am
duncs500 wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2019 5:43 am I haven't seen any evidence of an increase in abusive behavior towards immigrants. I've heard a few stories, but they're not different or more frequent from the ones I heard long before Brexit (for those that don't remember, my wife is Polish and so for the last 8 years I've been regaled with all her experiences and that of the people she knows).

I think there's a certain increased fear factor among immigrants from the EU due to Brexit, which perhaps might mean when something does happen they are more likely to attribute it to Brexit, but the idiots have always been there, I don't think there's suddenly a lot more of them. In fact, at the moment I'm lucky enough to work in a hugely diverse team of races and nationalities, and it's quite clear in my experience that we live in the most enlightened and tolerant era that I've ever known.
Same, and I spent 7 months sleeping in a hospital chatting to nurses which were mostly from Eastern Europe and they didn’t mention any changes but the South East and London don’t care as much anyway as it’s all much more multicultural.
I’m a bit disappointed in the people who decided to pack bags and return to their home countries due to racism - the world would be a really sad place if everyone had that attitude and no equality rights would have been created in the first place.
The ones I was talking about didn’t go back to their home countries, they went to other EU countries (Germany, Ireland, France and Italy IIRC)
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duncs500
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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Had those incidents that encouraged them to leave happened to them though Rev? Or had the media given the impression to them that these sort of things were on the rise? After the result the wife was worried for a while too, and I remember her showing me a few media bits about stuff happening around that time, but nothing happened to her or the people she knows and things seem to have moved on.

Of course it still happens and right around the time of the referendum I'm sure a few people crawled out of the woodwork, but I'd suggest the decent majority have put most of them back in their box.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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duncs500 wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:05 am Had those incidents that encouraged them to leave happened to them though Rev?
Yes.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by Swervin_Mervin »

My b-i-l has worked with a lot of Polish in particular. He says of those he knows that have gone back most were because back home has come on so far they no longer feel they need to be here to earn a good wage. He also said there's a few that don't want to go back because they've realised how rude their people come across back home, and they're used to the more polite English nature now :lol:
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by duncs500 »

There are certainly quite a number of eastern Europeans that, having mostly initially been economic immigrants, have come to love this country and couldn't entertain going back home.

On the other hand, there are economic immigrants who are here solely to be wealthy when they go back home, or send money back. Some of these people despise the culture and people in this country and just slag the whole place off. Wife knows some of these, and her opinion is that they should fuck off back if they hate it so much.
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NotoriousREV
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by NotoriousREV »

Ah, so is it finally constitutional crisis time?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49493632
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by ZedLeg »

Could the Queen say no or is it just a formality at this point?

Got to love this good old fashioned democracy.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation. We watched similar happen in South American countries, African nations and Balkan states and shook our heads. Now it’s happening here. How far we’ve fallen in such a short space of time.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by evostick »

NotoriousREV wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:27 am A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation. We watched similar happen in South American countries, African nations and Balkan states and shook our heads. Now it’s happening here. How far we’ve fallen in such a short space of time.
:lol:

Dry 'em.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by NotoriousREV »

evostick wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:29 am
NotoriousREV wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:27 am A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation. We watched similar happen in South American countries, African nations and Balkan states and shook our heads. Now it’s happening here. How far we’ve fallen in such a short space of time.
:lol:

Dry 'em.
Fascist scum.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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NotoriousREV wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:27 am A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation.
They're not 'forcing through' any legislation - its already on the statue books. If parliament didn't want the possibility of leaving in this manner the act could have been drafted differently. If they failed to foresee that this eventuality could arise then they need to take a long hard look in the mirror as part of the blame lies with them.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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We can probably rely on the Queen here, but if Parliament is suspended the MPs won't do nothing. My fiver is on a majority of the MPs bringing a case in court to stop the Government in those circumstances.

Still not a constitutional crisis; it's the sign of our constitution working.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by GG. »

Rely on the queen to do what? Not take the advice of the Privy counselors and make a separate determination - that is a constitutional crisis.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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GG. wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:32 am
NotoriousREV wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:27 am A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation.
They're not 'forcing through' any legislation - its already on the statue books. If parliament didn't want the possibility of leaving in this manner the act could have been drafted differently. If they failed to foresee that this eventuality could arise then they need to take a long hard look in the mirror as part of the blame lies with them.
The blame lies with Johnson.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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GG. wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:35 am Rely on the queen to do what? Not take the advice of the Privy counselors and make a separate determination - that is a constitutional crisis.
I suspect the Queen will do whatever the PC decides. But we’re in uncharted territory, I think.
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

Post by Swervin_Mervin »

NotoriousREV wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:27 am A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation.
Just out of interest - if Boris were to secure a new deal to take back to Parliament, would the timescales between the 14th-31st allow enough time for it to be voted on?
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Re: Bye Bye Boris!

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Swervin_Mervin wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:42 am
NotoriousREV wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:27 am A minority government suspends the democratically elected parliament to force through divisive legislation.
Just out of interest - if Boris were to secure a new deal to take back to Parliament, would the timescales between the 14th-31st allow enough time for it to be voted on?
I’m not sure but they have control of the timetable. I agree on the need for certainty and we should really resolve this mess one way or another as quickly as possible, but it is absolutely unconscionable that our parliamentary democracy be dismantled to hit what is an arbitrary deadline. (Especially when told not to waste time but instead we had a Conservative leader fight followed by a parliamentary recess).
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