More Boeing Woes for the 737

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scotta
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More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by scotta »

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2020/01/0 ... blank_bug/

Control screens going blank on runway approach - well that'll be handy...
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Gavin
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by Gavin »

I remember reading a book about air crashes and investigating them. The thing that was pointed out in the book is that it is always the Airframe manufacturer that is splashed across the press, never the engine guys, the electrical systems guys. The servicing is never mentioned. I am sure they are investigated fully but like a Daily Heil retraction, it passes by almost unnoticed.

No idea on this one but it did make me wonder as if your car has done 100k and you are in a crash it is likely to be down to crap maintenance than an inherent design flaw.
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GG.
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by GG. »

I'm not sure that's any different from any complex machine made from thousands of constituent parts across numerous suppliers though. If you alternator goes on your BMW you wouldn't look to Bosch to replace it - you'd complain about the reliability of BMWs and take it back to them as the manufacturer of the complete vehicle.

As far as I'm aware, you buy the plane from Boeing as a complete item therefore they're prima facie culpable to the buyer for defects (though they may sue suppliers behind the scenes).

I get the point if its third party maintenance firms that are failing to keep the planes in good order though - not really fair to blame the manufacturer for that.
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Gavin
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by Gavin »

If I remember from the book, Boeing often send just the airframe out for engine manufacturers to fit so it goes to RR for instance. Whether that is the same as with electrics etc I don't know and the book was from a few years back and it had changed but it was interesting.

I get your point, indeed you do complain to BMW rather than Bosch but the book was a sort of counterpoint, I wish I could remember what it was called, I cannot even remember of if it was like a Michael Chrichton style story based on fact or recounted an actual investigation into specific crashes as it must be twenty years ago I read it but their point was it might be the fault was entirely down to bad maintenance or bad engine installation but what would be reported and what we would remember would be "Boeing falls out the sky"
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GG.
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by GG. »

At least in the case of the 737 Max issue, the software that malfunctioned was specifically designed to deal with an airframe design flaw / engine incompatibility inherent in the original design by them so I think they're clearly culpable for that issue.

Having read the above link on the screens going blank - that's clearly also a software issue (rather than hardware or maintenance). Not sure whether the software engineers are employed by Boeing or a separate firm.
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by DaveE »

Gavin wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:55 am If I remember from the book, Boeing often send just the airframe out for engine manufacturers to fit so it goes to RR for instance.
Really? They send a plane, minus the engines to RR who fit the engines, then send it all back again?
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by NotoriousREV »

DaveE wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:02 pm
Gavin wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:55 am If I remember from the book, Boeing often send just the airframe out for engine manufacturers to fit so it goes to RR for instance.
Really? They send a plane, minus the engines to RR who fit the engines, then send it all back again?
No.
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NotoriousREV
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by NotoriousREV »

Also, shouldn’t the title be “More 737 woes for Boeing”?
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by Rich B »

NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:13 pm Also, shouldn’t the title be “More 737 woes for Boeing”?
Time to get a job Dave!
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by NotoriousREV »

Rich B wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:57 pm
NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:13 pm Also, shouldn’t the title be “More 737 woes for Boeing”?
Time to get a job, Dave!
Punctuation is important!
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by Swervin_Mervin »

NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:59 pm
Rich B wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:57 pm
NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:13 pm Also, shouldn’t the title be “More 737 woes for Boeing”?
Time to get a job, Dave!
Punctuation is important!
Word.
DaveE
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by DaveE »

NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:11 pm
DaveE wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:02 pm
Gavin wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:55 am If I remember from the book, Boeing often send just the airframe out for engine manufacturers to fit so it goes to RR for instance.
Really? They send a plane, minus the engines to RR who fit the engines, then send it all back again?
No.
Didn't think so :)
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ZedLeg
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by ZedLeg »

Would love to see the thought process of the person who thinks it would make sense to transport a giant airframe rather than a couple of engines :lol:.
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scotta
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by scotta »

NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:59 pm
Rich B wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:57 pm
NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:13 pm Also, shouldn’t the title be “More 737 woes for Boeing”?
Time to get a job, Dave!
Punctuation is important!
Get a job.
Fuck off.
YC
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NotoriousREV
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by NotoriousREV »

scotta wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 3:03 pm
NotoriousREV wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:59 pm
Rich B wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:57 pm Time to get a job, Dave!
Punctuation is important!
Get a job.
Fuck off.
YC
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mik
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by mik »

If you're having plane problems I feel bad for you son,
I've got 737 problems, but a Boeing ain't one.
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GG.
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by GG. »

All rappers buy Gulfstreams so I guess you're correct Sir Miksalot.

ETA - apart from Drake who does have a Boeing, seemingly :lol:



Looks pretty pimp tho (I'm sure teh kidz don't say that anymore)
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Gavin
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by Gavin »

DaveE wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:02 pm
Gavin wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:55 am If I remember from the book, Boeing often send just the airframe out for engine manufacturers to fit so it goes to RR for instance.
Really? They send a plane, minus the engines to RR who fit the engines, then send it all back again?
I just watched a YouTube video and they are built in Renton or certainly assembled there. They do build the fuselage offsite and train it to Renton.

Given the book I read was at least thirty years ago (and it may have been old then) there it's no huge surprise my memory wasn't correct. My point was that people mention the plane even if the engines failed and at the time, they were supplied by external companies.

I am still hoping next holiday it is Airbus...
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mik
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by mik »

Gavin wrote: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:49 am My point was that people mention the plane even if the engines failed and at the time, they were supplied by external companies.

I am still hoping next holiday it is Airbus...
You’ve kinda just reinforced this though, as you didn’t say something like “ I am still hoping next holiday it is on an aircraft with RR engines” :? Or “ I am still hoping next holiday it is an aircraft with Mick Newey designed air vents”
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Gavin
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Re: More Boeing Woes for the 737

Post by Gavin »

Yup, I know. My use of an ellipsis and the "still" makes that pretty clear in fact but cheers! :D
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